Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

From Wiki :
The first generation of the GTO is credited as popularizing the muscle car market segment in the 1960s.[2][3] The Pontiac GTO is considered by some to have started the trend with all four domestic automakers offering a variety of competing models.


Origins (of the GTO)

In early 1963, General Motors' management banned divisions from involvement in auto racing. This followed the 1957 voluntary ban on automobile racing that was instituted by the Automobile Manufacturers Association.[6] By the early 1960s, Pontiac's advertising and marketing approach was heavily based on performance. With GM's ban on factory-sponsored racing, Pontiac's managers began to emphasize street performance.

In his autobiography Glory Days, Pontiac chief marketing manager Jim Wangers, who worked for the division's contract advertising and public relations agency, states that John DeLorean, Bill Collins, and Russ Gee were responsible for the GTO's creation. It involved transforming the upcoming second-generation Pontiac Tempest (which reverted to a conventional front-engine with front transmission configuration) into a sporty car, with a larger 389 cu in (6.4 L) Pontiac V8 engine from the full-sized Pontiac Grand Prix hardtop coupe in place of the standard 326 cu in (5.3 L) V8. By promoting the big-engine option as a special high-performance model, they could appeal to the youth market (which had also been recognized by Ford Motor Company's Lee Iacocca, who was at that time preparing the Ford Mustang variant of the second generation Ford Falcon compact).

The GTO disregarded GM's policy limiting the A-body intermediate line to a maximum engine displacement of 330 cu in (5.4 L). The development team discovered a loophole in the policy which does not restrict large engines to be offered as an option.[1] Pontiac general manager Elliot "Pete" Estes approved the new model with sales manager Frank Bridge limiting initial production to 5,000 cars.


As a great radio host once said "words mean things "

Carry on...

Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

I’d prefer Mid Size Muscle Car…..

The definition of a muscle car is a bit more nebulous, because there was no single model that spawned the muscle car wars. But the recipe is simple enough: Drop a huge V8 into a two-door coupe and optimize only for straight-line speed. Raw power, lack of sophistication, and that distinctly American swagger are the hallmarks of all the great muscle cars.

Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

Even though I'm a Mopar guy now. I always thought the 1965 Pontiac 2plus2 was a great looking hotrod. !967 427 fastback Impala was very cool too.

Paul Haszlauer

Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

This gets tricky since the question was about cars currently being racing but we're sidetracked on definition. It was probably different for a lot of people.

If you look back, the cars we're talking about weren't originally called muscle cars. Check any mid 60s magazine with tests of these cars and they were referred to as super cars. Muscle car came later.

For me, it was the cars we were racing back then, on the street and on the strip. Note that the statute of limitations has expired [lol) Some cars were considered worthy and it was almost never the family car.

My definition is any 60s to early 70s (before smog) performance package car. By that I mean that a 327/300 was an upgrade from the standard 327/250 but was not a muscle car. A L79 certainly was.

My best (though a bit vague) shot is a car with increased camshaft, intake manifold, compression ratio, and probably what the manufacturers classed as severe duty rear end and suspension.

Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

Wikipedia definitions are just the opinions of whoever wrote the entry. A muscle car is whatever you think it is. I graduated HS in 1971 and any two-door sedan with a high performance or tricked-out engine was considered a muscle car in those circles. The term "muscle" as related to cars of that day and age was pretty non-specific in terms of body style, but always related to performance, mainly drag race. Witness FoMoCo's parts and information catalog from 1969/1970 which was titled "Muscle Parts" and is quite an interesting read. Check out the price list in the back!

https://www.mustangtek.com/Library2/MuscleParts.html

Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

Yet another thread derailed by the "I know more than you do" syndrome.

I would say Jason Line's Buick should be in the conversation...fingers crossed that the semantics police allow it.

Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

I would say Jason's car fills the bill. In fact , that's the first one I thought of.
BTW , nice "shoebox" you have there.

Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

Full size cars years before the GTO were muscle cars to me

Chevy's, Pontiac's, Ford's and Mopars and some others all had big motor options and 4 speeds and some with multiple carb options....

I took a ride in a brand new '64 Plymouth 426 street wedge 4 speed convertible before I had a license with a buddy and that car sure was a muscle car to me on that ride !!

Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

Wow, did this run off the rails, I think it is safe to assume what this guy was asking is what were the fastest 60's / 70's era cars that ran in Stock. Instead, it turned into some sort of argument about what exactly is classified as a muscle car, I don't think that was the point of the question.

Re: Quickest traditional Muscle Cars in Stock
 

I don't know, Jim
I think the only thing that is safe to assume it the o/p would like to hear about more FE powered Mustangs.
So, now that we've learned that a musclecar can be anything you want it to be, including full size and convertibles, I'll go with the Shelby style Mustangs of Bill hawk, Jim Morgan, and Kenny Meile.