What about STOCK ? - Page 2

Chip THELEGEND Johnson · 08-01-2007, 02:44 PM

Did'nt mean to step on Zanes toes. He always comes to the 20K at Piedmont. In fact he was R/U a couple years ago.
Chip

stockracer · 08-01-2007, 02:52 PM

I can be nameless because I talk crap about no one unless I use my real name...But thats no what this topic is about. I guess stock is easy to win in, thats why everybody has the wallys at home, and everybody chooses to race stock...ITS EASY...bull ****, probably one of the hardest classes out there. Buttons are easier to change I will agree, BUT its the same as anything else, you have to be good to make it work. I know a lot of guys that have tried a button and find it too hard to do so they go back to footbraking. Whats there excuse? I only brought up the point of msd and linelocks because everyone wants stock to be stock (or thier version of) If were goin to pick and choose no one will be happy. I DO think you will see a change, though, if you take buttons away in stock...but only for bout half a year, then the same people will still win! What about blocking, or people with 20/20 vision, or people who are just plain good? Lets get rid of all them too! Racing is not what it used to be and as soon as all the old guys realize its not always about goin fast and bustin nuckles, it will be a lot more enjoyable! Keep em commin!

Oldtimer · 08-01-2007, 02:53 PM

Amen....what he said......get rid of the bottons !
Bob Pagano

Blingmaster · 08-01-2007, 03:06 PM

If you really want to level the playing field turn off the reaction timers and 60 foot clocks...That has done more to make mediocre drivers in to Kings if that information not available how could they adjust...100 years ago when Smedley was young you had that Seat of the pants reaction timer you knew when you were late....DD

Michael Beard · 08-01-2007, 03:17 PM

Stockracer writes:
>> I would love for some of you to tell Fletch, Zane, Biondo, Stillings, Bertozzi, that they need to LEARN how to footbrake!

Actually, I personally invited one to come to the $50K. When I told him it was Footbrake, he was like, "I don't know, I haven't footbraked in a long time." I don't believe that meant he couldn't -- just didn't feel like it. I was shocked to not see some of them there except Zane.

Many argue that two-steps are no advantage, so we should continue to allow them. I think the same argument supports getting rid of them. There's really no reason to keep them, in my opinion.

Polls on the subject don't mean a lot. NHRA used a poll as a backwards way to support their decision to eliminate deep staging. "The majority of the racers didn't want deep staging." Using that logic, could the "majority of the racers" vote out trucks? front drivers? fuel injected cars? two-steps? vote in transbrakes?

And how do drivers that advocate two steps feel about deep staging?

The guys that advocate two steps argue that getting rid of them would make as much sense as getting rid of tachs, MSD's, shifters, etc. Such a rationale working in the opposite direction -- would that mean they wouldn't care if transbrakes were allowed? 4-wheel line locks? "Well, no, that's totally different" That's right - EVERY component is a totally separate issue unto itself.

I do disagree with Chip -- Although they'll have to adapt, I think that the top guys will still win just as much.... which further indicates to me that there's no need to have two steps in the first place.

* (exception being stick cars, in all instances above.)

>> If you really want to level the playing field turn off the reaction timers and 60 foot clocks...

I hear that pop up every once in a while. Au contraire - the best drivers would shine even more without that information, because they already know where they're at to begin with. The drivers that are lost would become even more lost. The best drivers are consistent enough to tweak the car to go red and then back it down, while the rest of the field wanders all over the tree. You could take away ALL of the incrementals, and the top echelon driver is still going to nail you .040 on the tree, carry a dime, wheel you at the stripe, and leave you wondering what happened. Not to hurt anyone's feelings, but that's just the reality of it.

Todd Bailey · 08-01-2007, 03:57 PM

For someone attempting to enter the world of Stock Elim, it is an added expense/headache, etc to have to worry about a button and the "electronics" that go with it. Stock should be just that: Stock. As for the individual who commented about getting rid of the Disc brakes, fuel cells, etc, the progress in Drag Racing is to go quicker and faster and these racers are doing just that deeming the need for improved safety in better brakes and fuel systems for examples. It doesn't help with the light but it does you a better feel that you can safely stop your car.

08-01-2007, 03:57 PM

Chip,

How's the new car coming ? I need you to send me an e-mail,I have plenty of RV-455 on hand
or call me @ 757-810-1832...

Mike,
You are right on the buttons, why do we need them......... Dave...1033/stock(RV-455)

Casey Miles · 08-01-2007, 04:51 PM

Stock can soon be Super Pro on 9" tires. Get all the electronics out of the formula.
Casey Miles
248H

Harry 6674 · 08-01-2007, 06:05 PM

I've said it before and I always get burned but here goes. Do away with the shoe polish, this is supposed to be class racing not bracket racing. Run off the national record, have a CIC like comp. Reward the #1 qualifier and record setters. Its supposed to be a performance based eliminator. It used to be. Try it again. There a lot cheaper ways to bracket race. And do away with the electronics. Okay dialins let me have it.

Jim Bailey · 08-01-2007, 08:06 PM

My post was directed to Lenny and NHRA. Now that you guys have "admitted" that adjustable buttons have delay capibilties, and since delay devices are not allowed in Stock Elim. Are adjustable buttons considered delay devices?
Since only approved buttons will be allowed in Comp. and SS in 2008. Will only approved, non- adjustable,(non - delay) buttons be allowed as two step buttons in Stock Elim.?
Why not take it one step further.....At the Top of the Food Chain, ie Fuel Classes,(lol)..... the forward motion of the car must be done by the drivers feet, ie - The Bernstein Terrible Towel Rule of the 80s." And by all indications, Two Steps aren't going any where." Why don't you guys approve a spec, NON- Adjustable button for Stock Elim.. Then, mandate that the button be mounted on the brake or clutch pedal. It's not a completely level playing field, but, it's a start.
Don't get me wrong, my vote is for no buttons whatsoever. No buttons is way too easy to tech, and eliminates 80-90% chance of cheating. And why would we ever make it that easy.

08-01-2007, 02:44 PM	#11
Chip THELEGEND Johnson Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 284 Likes: 223 Liked 280 Times in 79 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Did'nt mean to step on Zanes toes. He always comes to the 20K at Piedmont. In fact he was R/U a couple years ago. Chip

08-01-2007, 02:52 PM	#12
stockracer Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 79 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? I can be nameless because I talk crap about no one unless I use my real name...But thats no what this topic is about. I guess stock is easy to win in, thats why everybody has the wallys at home, and everybody chooses to race stock...ITS EASY...bull ****, probably one of the hardest classes out there. Buttons are easier to change I will agree, BUT its the same as anything else, you have to be good to make it work. I know a lot of guys that have tried a button and find it too hard to do so they go back to footbraking. Whats there excuse? I only brought up the point of msd and linelocks because everyone wants stock to be stock (or thier version of) If were goin to pick and choose no one will be happy. I DO think you will see a change, though, if you take buttons away in stock...but only for bout half a year, then the same people will still win! What about blocking, or people with 20/20 vision, or people who are just plain good? Lets get rid of all them too! Racing is not what it used to be and as soon as all the old guys realize its not always about goin fast and bustin nuckles, it will be a lot more enjoyable! Keep em commin!

08-01-2007, 02:53 PM	#13
Oldtimer Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Arkansas Posts: 87 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Amen....what he said......get rid of the bottons ! Bob Pagano __________________ Bob Pagano L88BOB@aol.com www.dyainc.org 4033 AA/SA

08-01-2007, 03:06 PM	#14
Blingmaster Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: usa Posts: 83 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? If you really want to level the playing field turn off the reaction timers and 60 foot clocks...That has done more to make mediocre drivers in to Kings if that information not available how could they adjust...100 years ago when Smedley was young you had that Seat of the pants reaction timer you knew when you were late....DD

08-01-2007, 03:17 PM	#15
Michael Beard VIP Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 4,060 Likes: 0 Liked 12 Times in 8 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Stockracer writes: >> I would love for some of you to tell Fletch, Zane, Biondo, Stillings, Bertozzi, that they need to LEARN how to footbrake! Actually, I personally invited one to come to the $50K. When I told him it was Footbrake, he was like, "I don't know, I haven't footbraked in a long time." I don't believe that meant he couldn't -- just didn't feel like it. I was shocked to not see some of them there except Zane. Many argue that two-steps are no advantage, so we should continue to allow them. I think the same argument supports getting rid of them. There's really no reason to keep them, in my opinion. Polls on the subject don't mean a lot. NHRA used a poll as a backwards way to support their decision to eliminate deep staging. "The majority of the racers didn't want deep staging." Using that logic, could the "majority of the racers" vote out trucks? front drivers? fuel injected cars? two-steps? vote in transbrakes? And how do drivers that advocate two steps feel about deep staging? The guys that advocate two steps argue that getting rid of them would make as much sense as getting rid of tachs, MSD's, shifters, etc. Such a rationale working in the opposite direction -- would that mean they wouldn't care if transbrakes were allowed? 4-wheel line locks? "Well, no, that's totally different" That's right - EVERY component is a totally separate issue unto itself. I do disagree with Chip -- Although they'll have to adapt, I think that the top guys will still win just as much.... which further indicates to me that there's no need to have two steps in the first place. * (exception being stick cars, in all instances above.) >> If you really want to level the playing field turn off the reaction timers and 60 foot clocks... I hear that pop up every once in a while. Au contraire - the best drivers would shine even more without that information, because they already know where they're at to begin with. The drivers that are lost would become even more lost. The best drivers are consistent enough to tweak the car to go red and then back it down, while the rest of the field wanders all over the tree. You could take away ALL of the incrementals, and the top echelon driver is still going to nail you .040 on the tree, carry a dime, wheel you at the stripe, and leave you wondering what happened. Not to hurt anyone's feelings, but that's just the reality of it. __________________ Michael Beard - NHRA/IHRA 3216 S/SS Last edited by Michael Beard; 08-01-2007 at 03:23 PM. Reason: added last quote & paragraph

08-01-2007, 03:57 PM	#16
Todd Bailey Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Houston Posts: 302 Likes: 24 Liked 28 Times in 14 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? For someone attempting to enter the world of Stock Elim, it is an added expense/headache, etc to have to worry about a button and the "electronics" that go with it. Stock should be just that: Stock. As for the individual who commented about getting rid of the Disc brakes, fuel cells, etc, the progress in Drag Racing is to go quicker and faster and these racers are doing just that deeming the need for improved safety in better brakes and fuel systems for examples. It doesn't help with the light but it does you a better feel that you can safely stop your car.

08-01-2007, 03:57 PM	#17
RIBEIRO RACING Guest Posts: n/a	Re: What about STOCK ? Chip, How's the new car coming ? I need you to send me an e-mail,I have plenty of RV-455 on hand or call me @ 757-810-1832... Mike, You are right on the buttons, why do we need them......... Dave...1033/stock(RV-455)

08-01-2007, 04:51 PM	#18
Casey Miles Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 692 Likes: 119 Liked 445 Times in 83 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Stock can soon be Super Pro on 9" tires. Get all the electronics out of the formula. Casey Miles 248H

08-01-2007, 06:05 PM	#19
Harry 6674 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 589 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? I've said it before and I always get burned but here goes. Do away with the shoe polish, this is supposed to be class racing not bracket racing. Run off the national record, have a CIC like comp. Reward the #1 qualifier and record setters. Its supposed to be a performance based eliminator. It used to be. Try it again. There a lot cheaper ways to bracket race. And do away with the electronics. Okay dialins let me have it.

08-01-2007, 08:06 PM	#20
Jim Bailey Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 698 Likes: 17 Liked 568 Times in 106 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? My post was directed to Lenny and NHRA. Now that you guys have "admitted" that adjustable buttons have delay capibilties, and since delay devices are not allowed in Stock Elim. Are adjustable buttons considered delay devices? Since only approved buttons will be allowed in Comp. and SS in 2008. Will only approved, non- adjustable,(non - delay) buttons be allowed as two step buttons in Stock Elim.? Why not take it one step further.....At the Top of the Food Chain, ie Fuel Classes,(lol)..... the forward motion of the car must be done by the drivers feet, ie - The Bernstein Terrible Towel Rule of the 80s." And by all indications, Two Steps aren't going any where." Why don't you guys approve a spec, NON- Adjustable button for Stock Elim.. Then, mandate that the button be mounted on the brake or clutch pedal. It's not a completely level playing field, but, it's a start. Don't get me wrong, my vote is for no buttons whatsoever. No buttons is way too easy to tech, and eliminates 80-90% chance of cheating. And why would we ever make it that easy.