Ladder bar tuning / adjusting

[cmracing]

Originally Posted by joespanova

I probably said that wrong......what I was saying is the hole geometry will "conflict" with the bars once I start moving the adjuster as much as I need to get the angle down.......in other words you really only have a limited amount of range to move /adjust.

I understand where you're coming from.

First of all, I used their bars for a long time, they are beefy for sure! And they told me they would never use a heim joint in the front, and I see why. It takes a ton of runs, but they eventually start to bend.....

When the bars and brackets are first setup you need to make some compromises. You just ran into one of those initial issues. To move your bar you may run out of adjustment range with the adjuster on the lower bar. if that is the case, you have to remove the bars completely and change the position of the upper and lower rod ends so everything will line-up once again. Pain in the butt for sure!

When I did mine I put the ladder bar in so the front was running downhill compared to the rocker panel. I have been anywhere from 1.50 to 1.2x 60fts, depending on what I was doing with the engine at the time. Has always been a Power Glide with 1.80 low gear, but rear gears ranged from 4.30's to 4.88's, and no nitrous or a lot of nitrous. It always hooked, wheelstands where an issue with a lot of spray. Used wheelie bars to control that. I never, ever mover the front of the ladder bar though.

Maybe if I wanted to hit the tree better I could experiment, but unlike a 4 link, it isn't so simple to just move the bar up or down a hole........

[Rory McNeil]

[QUOTE=cmracing;532611]I understand where you're coming from.

First of all, I used their bars for a long time, they are beefy for sure! And they told me they would never use a heim joint in the front, and I see why. It takes a ton of runs, but they eventually start to bend.....

I have been running Art Morrison ladder bars on my 3100 lb bracket car for 30 years now, along with the basic Morrison coil spring kit. When I bought the ladder bars, we installed them per Morrisons instructions, with the lower bar level, and parallel to the rocker panel. When I bought the ladder bar kit, the bars came with 6 3/4" solid rod ends, and no lower adjusters. After a while, I elected to replace the front solid rod ends with good quality Aurora chrome moly Heim ends, I just did not like the idea of not being able to tighten the front ladder bar bolts, which would cause binding. With the spherical rod end, you can tighten the bolt up, and still have the ball free to pivot. I have never found any bending or play in the front rod ends, although I have replaced them a couple of times for peace of mind. There is a big difference between a good quality $75.00 a piece joint, and a no name $12. piece. I also had lower bar adjusters installed about 20 years ago, so I could try moving the front ladder bar pivot location. Going lower made the back of the car rise more, going to the top of 3 holes didn`t really make a noticeable change, so I went back to the middle position, and have not touched it in many years. The car has always hooked well, and went straight, so I am leaving well enough alone. 3100 pound back half car with 105 1/2" wheelbase, 56% on the front tires, 32" long ladder bars, with a mild 428 FE Ford and 4 speed Jerico, best 60 foot of 1.29, 9.97ET@132 MPH.

[Dragsinger]

some more information to consider;

*this Monte Carlo is 3155 pounds with driver
*408 CI SBC
*powerglide
*footbrake
*31 x 13 radial tire

*The ladder bar is 32" center of rear axle to center of the front rod end. It is 2 degrees down in relation to the ground in this photo.The right ladder bar has one-half flat pre-load

It also has an anti-roll bar that is set neutral.

This car is excellent, consistent, and predictable. It runs 6.0's 1/8 mile

[Mike Pearson]

I have been racing a ladder bar car for over 35 years. This is how I set my car up
The bottom bar of the ladder bar is set to2 degrees down angle from the rocker panel. Then 2 degrees pinion angle. Do not go beyond parallel to the rocker or frame or the car will not plant the tire. You can make small adjustments to the angle by adjusting the ride height. Bad track loosen the shocks front and rear. Good track tighten the shocks. If you have double adjustable front shocks set the compression near as tight as you can on the front to keep the from slamming down hard and unloading the back tires or bouncing
My car will 60 ft in the high 1.20s and 330 in the 3.96 range when conditions are good and the engine is making power. I have a powerglife trans in my car. 3160 lbs.

[joespanova]

Originally Posted by cmracing

I understand where you're coming from.

"You have to remove the bars completely and change the position of the upper and lower rod ends so everything will line-up once again. Pain in the butt for sure!


Maybe if I wanted to hit the tree better I could experiment, but unlike a 4 link, it isn't so simple to just move the bar up or down a hole........

I've had the bars off completely , and IIRC thats when I made the observation about everything not going back together without a fight........been a while though. Actually , moving the bars up or down IS relatively easy.......suprised you would suggest that.

[joespanova]

Originally Posted by Mike Pearson

I have been racing a ladder bar car for over 35 years. This is how I set my car up
The bottom bar of the ladder bar is set to2 degrees down angle from the rocker panel. Then 2 degrees pinion angle. Do not go beyond parallel to the rocker or frame or the car will not plant the tire. You can make small adjustments to the angle by adjusting the ride height. Bad track loosen the shocks front and rear. Good track tighten the shocks. If you have double adjustable front shocks set the compression near as tight as you can on the front to keep the from slamming down hard and unloading the back tires or bouncing
My car will 60 ft in the high 1.20s and 330 in the 3.96 range when conditions are good and the engine is making power. I have a powerglife trans in my car. 3160 lbs.

How quick do you run when you get the 1.2? 60fts? You do run a 350 right?

[Mike Pearson]

Originally Posted by joespanova

how quick do you run when you get the 1.2? 60fts? You do run a 350 right?

9.90. Yes actually about 365 cu in as the engine is about .075 over

[joespanova]

Originally Posted by Mike Pearson

9.90. Yes actually about 365 cu in as the engine is about .075 over

Geezus...........
see this is what this is really all about.......better 60s ,launch etc etc.........
I'm consistent in the 9.40s and I've NEVER had a 1.20 ANYTHING 1.30s YES..........1.32-1.34ish......

[cmracing]

Originally Posted by joespanova

I've had the bars off completely , and IIRC thats when I made the observation about everything not going back together without a fight........been a while though. Actually , moving the bars up or down IS relatively easy.......suprised you would suggest that.

Moving the front of the bar is a piece of cake, but getting the pinion angle back to where you want it can be a whole 'nother story. You can easily run out of adjustment on the double adjuster, now what. You are forced to take the bars off to change the length of the upper and lower rod ends and get the double adjuster back in a usable range.

[Ed Carpenter]

I have a 66 Chevy II with a old school leaf spring ladder bar set up from the early 80's (I'm not joking). We have a 327350hp combo. We have the bars in the bottom hole with front shocks turned as tight as they will go and travel limiter a tight as they can go also. We are trying to stop the car from turning over. Anybody at the track can verify what I'm.saying. This thing goes higher in second gear than the actual launch. We run a stick car so different from setups talked about on here. Last time out in SS/H we ran career best of 9.65@135 with a 1.43 60'