289 ford question

lugnut5 · 11-10-2007, 10:44 PM

I posted this question about six months ago but never found the solution. I have a '66 289 that I'm building for a friends mustang. It is the original engine for the car. It even had the original rod & mains from 1965 in it when I disassembled it. Machine work includes; block bored .030, heads machined flat, 3 angle valve job, new valves, springs, locks, retainers, seals. New items include; frost plugs, cam bearings, reconditioned crank, new pistons, rings, cam & lifters, oil pump, etc... Here is the problem. When we first tried to fire the engine, it was trying to start hard, like a low battery but never started. I pulled the spark plugs out of the driver's side and they all had antifreeze between the center electrode and the ground strap. At this point I did a pressure test of the cooling system, which made antifreeze trickle out of the spark plug holes, but only on the driver's side of the engine the passenger side was fine. I was hoping that I installed the head gasket backwards. I removed the head from the driver's side, and saw that I didn't install the gasket backwards, as the "front" imprint on the gasket was towards the front of the engine. So I tried another Fel-Pro gaket, but had the same results. I decided to remove the intake from the engine, and with the rest of the cooling system still hooked up, I filled the water ports in the heads with water, then pressurized each cylinder. As I did this, air bubbles were noticed in the water ports of the heads. This happened in each of the driver's side cylinders when they were pressurized but not on the passenger side. Then I tried a different head from a known running engine. Did the same proceedure and had the same results. I then had the original head checked for flatness and pressure tested. It passed both tests. So decided to remove the engine from the car, completly disassemble it and have the block pressure tested and checked for flatness. The driver's side surface of the block was found to be .004 from being flat, so both sides were decked .010, then pressure tested, in wich it passed. I then installed the heads, timing cover, water pump & radiator on the bare block with no internal components and pressurized the cooling system. No leaks were found and the cooling system held 17 lbs. of pressure for 30 minutes. I completely reassembled the engine, minus the intake, swapped heads from driver's side to passenger side and vice-versa. Hooked up the cooling system, filled it with water and pressurized each cylinder. To my frustration I had the same results, again in all cylinders on the driver's side only, visable air bubbles in the water ports. ARGH! So I removed the head and tried a different brand of head gasket only to have the same results. Then I intentionally installed the gasket backwards just to see what would happen. The results were less air bubbles, but non the less, I still had air in the cooling system, and when I pressurize the cooling system water comes out of the driver's spark plug holes. I'm using the original head bolts and have checked to make sure they are not too long. I know it's not intake because I'm doing the tests without the intake on the engine and can see the air bubbles in the warter ports of the heads. If it was one or two cylinders I would say it's a cracked block, but it happens in all four cylinders. Why would it pass the cooling system pressure test when the block has no internal parts installed, then fail the test when the crank, rods, pistons, cam and timing chain assembly is installed? I have had all the reputable machinists in my area look at this engine and can't find a solution. I have had this engine for 8 months. Needless to say, the guy that owns it is becoming impatient. Any help in this matter would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks guys.

SSDiv6 · 11-12-2007, 10:43 AM

Have you had the block and cylinder heads checked for hairline cracks? If the block and cylinder heads check out okay, I would remove any traces of engine coolant, fill the cooling system half way and add 4 to 6 ounces of Sodium Silicate also known as "Egg Glass" or "Water Glass" and then top the cooling system.

Run the engine for at least a minimum of 30 minutes or drive it for at least 20 miles. Drain the cooling system and flush with water. Remove all the spark plugs and keep the throttle open for 24 hours so the engine can dry. It should fix the problem; many times it takes two tries. I have used Sodium Silicate in the past and it works; just do not add too much because it can block the radiator and water pump. A friend has a tractor that he forgot to drain the water during winter; the engine froze and the block had a hairline crack. Did the Sodium Silicate treatment and the block has not leaked for the past 12 years.

Many may think this is a band-aid, but it is not. Bar-Leaks and many of these similar products, contain a certain amount of Sodium Silicate, but not enough. As a matter of fact, Jaguar recommends the addition of two bottles of Bars-Leak to the cooling system everytime you do a head gasket or overhaul the engine. General Motors also sells what they call the "Cooling System Sealant Tablets", P/N 12378254. General Motors has used them as a either a preventative measure or as part of their Technical Service Bulletins for all their engines.

11-10-2007, 10:44 PM	#1
lugnut5 Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: upstate N.Y. Posts: 8 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	289 ford question I posted this question about six months ago but never found the solution. I have a '66 289 that I'm building for a friends mustang. It is the original engine for the car. It even had the original rod & mains from 1965 in it when I disassembled it. Machine work includes; block bored .030, heads machined flat, 3 angle valve job, new valves, springs, locks, retainers, seals. New items include; frost plugs, cam bearings, reconditioned crank, new pistons, rings, cam & lifters, oil pump, etc... Here is the problem. When we first tried to fire the engine, it was trying to start hard, like a low battery but never started. I pulled the spark plugs out of the driver's side and they all had antifreeze between the center electrode and the ground strap. At this point I did a pressure test of the cooling system, which made antifreeze trickle out of the spark plug holes, but only on the driver's side of the engine the passenger side was fine. I was hoping that I installed the head gasket backwards. I removed the head from the driver's side, and saw that I didn't install the gasket backwards, as the "front" imprint on the gasket was towards the front of the engine. So I tried another Fel-Pro gaket, but had the same results. I decided to remove the intake from the engine, and with the rest of the cooling system still hooked up, I filled the water ports in the heads with water, then pressurized each cylinder. As I did this, air bubbles were noticed in the water ports of the heads. This happened in each of the driver's side cylinders when they were pressurized but not on the passenger side. Then I tried a different head from a known running engine. Did the same proceedure and had the same results. I then had the original head checked for flatness and pressure tested. It passed both tests. So decided to remove the engine from the car, completly disassemble it and have the block pressure tested and checked for flatness. The driver's side surface of the block was found to be .004 from being flat, so both sides were decked .010, then pressure tested, in wich it passed. I then installed the heads, timing cover, water pump & radiator on the bare block with no internal components and pressurized the cooling system. No leaks were found and the cooling system held 17 lbs. of pressure for 30 minutes. I completely reassembled the engine, minus the intake, swapped heads from driver's side to passenger side and vice-versa. Hooked up the cooling system, filled it with water and pressurized each cylinder. To my frustration I had the same results, again in all cylinders on the driver's side only, visable air bubbles in the water ports. ARGH! So I removed the head and tried a different brand of head gasket only to have the same results. Then I intentionally installed the gasket backwards just to see what would happen. The results were less air bubbles, but non the less, I still had air in the cooling system, and when I pressurize the cooling system water comes out of the driver's spark plug holes. I'm using the original head bolts and have checked to make sure they are not too long. I know it's not intake because I'm doing the tests without the intake on the engine and can see the air bubbles in the warter ports of the heads. If it was one or two cylinders I would say it's a cracked block, but it happens in all four cylinders. Why would it pass the cooling system pressure test when the block has no internal parts installed, then fail the test when the crank, rods, pistons, cam and timing chain assembly is installed? I have had all the reputable machinists in my area look at this engine and can't find a solution. I have had this engine for 8 months. Needless to say, the guy that owns it is becoming impatient. Any help in this matter would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks guys.

11-12-2007, 10:43 AM	#2
SSDiv6 VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Glendale, Arizona Posts: 2,991 Likes: 693 Liked 1,457 Times in 543 Posts	Re: 289 ford question Have you had the block and cylinder heads checked for hairline cracks? If the block and cylinder heads check out okay, I would remove any traces of engine coolant, fill the cooling system half way and add 4 to 6 ounces of Sodium Silicate also known as "Egg Glass" or "Water Glass" and then top the cooling system. Run the engine for at least a minimum of 30 minutes or drive it for at least 20 miles. Drain the cooling system and flush with water. Remove all the spark plugs and keep the throttle open for 24 hours so the engine can dry. It should fix the problem; many times it takes two tries. I have used Sodium Silicate in the past and it works; just do not add too much because it can block the radiator and water pump. A friend has a tractor that he forgot to drain the water during winter; the engine froze and the block had a hairline crack. Did the Sodium Silicate treatment and the block has not leaked for the past 12 years. Many may think this is a band-aid, but it is not. Bar-Leaks and many of these similar products, contain a certain amount of Sodium Silicate, but not enough. As a matter of fact, Jaguar recommends the addition of two bottles of Bars-Leak to the cooling system everytime you do a head gasket or overhaul the engine. General Motors also sells what they call the "Cooling System Sealant Tablets", P/N 12378254. General Motors has used them as a either a preventative measure or as part of their Technical Service Bulletins for all their engines.