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Old 09-24-2018, 01:23 AM   #1
6130
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Default Ss/vx?

It's a 12-pound class, with a 149 cubic inch maximum engine size (at 1788 pounds), or a 1600 pound minimum weight (at 133.33 cubic inches). Four gears and a single-disc clutch.

They are restricted to a 94.1mm bore, .630" solid lifter cam, 44.1mm intake valves, 37.5mm exhaust valves, and four 44mm carburetor venturis. This would seem to favor the smallest engine at the lightest weight, but having only four gears means huge jumps between gears, quite possibly pulling a small(er) engine (further) below it's torque peak after each gear change.

They have to run the stock style front and rear suspension, but it is allowed to cut and raise the rear torsion housing (to lower the car's body around it's drivetrain).

The index is 11.60, and they have gone 1.11-under at 10.49.

Anyone have any experience with something like this?

Last edited by 6130; 09-25-2018 at 02:11 PM.
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Old 09-24-2018, 05:03 PM   #2
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Default Re: Ss/vx?

there is a vw running out of oregon in VX
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Old 09-24-2018, 08:06 PM   #3
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Default Re: Ss/vx?

Mark Prothero ran @ indy a couple years ago, and Jack Sachette runs the same car now.

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Old 09-24-2018, 08:07 PM   #4
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Default Re: Ss/vx?

http://www.jayceevw.com/
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Old 09-25-2018, 01:51 AM   #5
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Default Re: Ss/vx?

Nitro Joe May specs:
SS/VX .
SS/VX 11.60 10.861 -0.739 724 Greg Tims '68 Beetle VW 137 Q WINTER NATS
SS/VX 11.60 11.064 -0.536 431C Bubba Clifton '82 Volkswagen VW 133 RD 2 D4R3 ENNIS
SS/VX 11.60 11.211 -0.389 4692 Ricky Marshall '66 Beetle VW 135 RD 1 D4R3 ENNIS

Nitro Joe Specs July:
SS/VX
SS/VX 11.60 10.861 -0.739 724 Greg Tims '68 Beetle VW 137 Q WINTER NATS
SS/VX 11.60 10.939 -0.661 726 David Stark '59 Ghia VW 137 Q D7R3 FONTANA
SS/VX 11.60 11.064 -0.536 431C Bubba Clifton '82 Volkswagen VW 133 RD 2 D4R3 ENNIS
SS/VX 11.60 11.114 -0.486 7922 Doug Colley '63 Beetle VW 142 Q D6R3 MISSION
SS/VX 11.60 11.211 -0.389 4692 Ricky Marshall '66 Beetle VW 135 RD 1 D4R3 ENNIS
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Old 09-25-2018, 05:39 AM   #6
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Default Re: Ss/vx?

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Lee View Post
there is a vw running out of oregon in VX
Yeah, that's Doug Colley. He's a really cool guy. I talked to him at the Northwest Nationals in Seattle.

Here's a video of Doug taking on the SS/AH car of Jerry Jenkins last year in Sonoma:


Last edited by 6130; 09-25-2018 at 05:42 AM.
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Old 09-25-2018, 12:51 PM   #7
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Default Re: Ss/vx?

Showed up in primer at the Pacific Raceways S/SS races. Note the low 11 dial in the window.
ssvx
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Old 09-25-2018, 02:03 PM   #8
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Default Re: Ss/vx?

That's not primer. It's grey paint. The car (a '63 I think) is very nicely put together. Of note, the front end is made by Creative Car Craft, and it is beautifully made. There is a much-cheaper front end that a lot of guys use, but the headlight area of the front fenders is visibly incorrect for the pre '67 cars, which makes them look kind of Frankensteined together. The CCC front end easily costs twice as much, but the car just looks great with it.

Doug is a smart guy. One of the things that has always kept me from being attracted to pursuing this, is the gearbox breakage issues. These guys are launching at up to about 9,000 rpm, using a gearbox originally designed in the '30s to be an inexpensive way to connect a 22-horsepower engine to the pavement. Everything about them is fragile. Doug had some interesting things to say on the subject.

Clutch selection, set-up, and management has always been an issue with keeping these things together. There used to be a device called a "Washington anti-shocker" that worked like a little shock absorber on the clutch arm, to slow down the clutch engagement. It's no longer made, but there are other ways of doing the same thing. Some guys convert to a hydraulic clutch and control the speed of clutch application with an orifice. Ron Lummus Racing has a fairly trick Rev-6 6" clutch that reportedly engages smoothly, but still holds high horsepower engines. It's about $1,000.

Doug said one of the weak links is the "spades" at the inboard end of the swing axles, so he's done away with that by using a billet-aluminum spool that has Porsche 930 Turbo CV joints inside of it, along with custom 300M splined axles. It's about $2,000 just for the spool.

A Klinkelnberg Palloid ring & pinion set is about $1,000. As you would expect for something originally designed to transmit a couple dozen horsepower, they are ridiculously small- about 6" diameter. And like all ring & pinion sets, the pinion head gets smaller and smaller as the ratio gets deeper and deeper, so using a physically stronger (less weak?) 3.88 or 3.44 ratio is the norm. Hitting them hard tries to push the ring gear out the side of the case. Billet aluminum side covers can help to hold it in place, but the OEM magnesium case itself is pretty weak, so a reinforced aluminum through-bolt "Rhino Case" would be the starting point for this kind of gearbox, and even then, it can be a good idea to weld some heavy aluminum external braces to the transaxle housing.

Then you would need to fill it with a bunch of racing gears from Weddle. They have a great selection, but no matter what gear stack you choose, it looks like it's going to pull the engine down below the torque peak on launch and on every shift.

I'm trying to learn as much as I can- something like this might be a fun retirement project. But I wish I could get some ideas for a baseline engine set-up, without asking these guys to give away their race secrets. I wouldn't be interested in setting a national record, I'd just like to know what it would take to comfortably run under index. I'm guessing heads-up races would be pretty unusual in this class.

Last edited by 6130; 09-26-2018 at 05:55 PM.
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Old 09-25-2018, 05:30 PM   #9
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Default Re: Ss/vx?

Not sure if they are legal for SS/VX or not, but we have 3 or 4 low to mid 10 second VW Beetles that race in our local BC Supershifter group, and they all run some aftermarket transaxle that uses ring & pinions from an American diff, not sure if its 12 bolt, 9 " , 8 3/4" or what it is. They are called Mendeola transaxles..
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Old 09-25-2018, 08:13 PM   #10
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Default Re: Ss/vx?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 6130 View Post
Yeah, that's Doug Colley. He's a really cool guy. I talked to him at the Northwest Nationals in Seattle.

Here's a video of Doug taking on the SS/AH car of Jerry Jenkins last year in Sonoma:

.011 to .097 told the tale.
Want to run a slow, stick car in S/SS or StK? Then you know what needs to be done, right?
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