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Old 05-29-2016, 08:53 AM   #1
joespanova
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Default Vac pump destruction / mystery

Ya' know............I've had more oil starvation problems in the last few years than probably 10-20 guys combined.
Lost 2 engines in 15 years....meaning blocks and some other hardware.
Even now , with my new Dart block , the main AND rod bearings look like sheeeot........... Nothing is damaged but the bearings will have to be replaced. I currently have a new Lunati crank.........this is no cheapo' either.
The one common denominator in every engine has been the vac pump.
I currently use a STD. volume "Moroso" melling OEM style pump ( modified by Moroso ) and a new pan. But it doesnt matter what I use.......I still have oiling problems.
Bearing clearances are .0025- .003 ( thats not per side , thats total ).
The vac pump with the regulator "out of the box" regulated down to the lowest setting still pulls 15" in high gear thru the lights. I've read on other web sites " Yellow Bullet" where plenty of guys are running 18-20 inches ( all wet sumps ) and not having issues. External pumps , accumulators......I have no idea......but I don't believe they all are. How they are getting away with that is beyond me.
Soooo............the vac pump must go. Its effectiveness ( if any ) is being waaay over shadowed by the destruction it causes. If I drop it down to say 10 inches......I would be just as well off using crankcase vents.Super Stock engines can't even use them.........apparently they innovate some creative PVC system .......but I was concerned that would introduce some oil into the intake.......so , I'm not doing that. RPM range is 87-8800.
Can I hear some opinions on this ?

Last edited by joespanova; 05-29-2016 at 08:56 AM.
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Old 05-29-2016, 12:47 PM   #2
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Default Re: Vac pump destruction / mystery

Pics of bearings and rest of engine combo 8700-8800RPMs?.Bill C.
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Old 05-29-2016, 01:17 PM   #3
joespanova
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Default Re: Vac pump destruction / mystery

Quote:
Originally Posted by CFMCNC View Post
Pics of bearings and rest of engine combo 8700-8800RPMs?.Bill C.
Why the question mark after the RPM?
No pics.........the bearings need to be replaced. What I see are bearings not getting sufficient oil. What exactly are you looking for?
I've used HV pumps ,STD volume pumps ,3 different oil pans , several different screen or baffle combos , 3- 4 different blocks , restrictors , no restrictors , WIX racing filters , K&N filters , 2 different cranks .........
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Old 05-29-2016, 03:11 PM   #4
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Default Re: Vac pump destruction / mystery

What is the main bearing diameter, what brand oil and weight ?
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Old 05-29-2016, 03:34 PM   #5
joespanova
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Default Re: Vac pump destruction / mystery

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What is the main bearing diameter, what brand oil and weight ?
Why would you ask me what the main journal dia. is? 2.450 / 2.449..........the clearances are .0025 /.003.
The current oil is Brad Penn. Break in oil ( 30 weight ) ...........this inspection is only after 5 trips down the track.
BTW.......this is a 350 inch engine.......

Last edited by joespanova; 05-29-2016 at 05:58 PM.
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Old 05-29-2016, 07:19 PM   #6
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Default Re: Vac pump destruction / mystery

Because journal diameter tells you how much oil clearance is needed. .0025"/.003" is fine. How about your rod journal dia & clearance?
I ran a vacuum pump on mine before I made an SS legal car of it. I used the same pump and clearances then as now. I have seen no difference in bearings. I doubt it's the pump.
How much oil pressure?
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Old 05-29-2016, 07:48 PM   #7
joespanova
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Default Re: Vac pump destruction / mystery

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Because journal diameter tells you how much oil clearance is needed. .0025"/.003" is fine. How about your rod journal dia & clearance?
I ran a vacuum pump on mine before I made an SS legal car of it. I used the same pump and clearances then as now. I have seen no difference in bearings. I doubt it's the pump.
How much oil pressure?
60 PLUS......
Did you lose any power worth noting WITHOUT the pump?
At this point I have little choice but to run it without the pump. The bearings looked as though there was trash in the engine , as bad as I've seen............but , it may well have been bearing decomposition getting in the oil?
I cant take any pics now since my wife has the camera and she's out of town.....
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Old 05-29-2016, 08:39 PM   #8
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Default Re: Vac pump destruction / mystery

On my old chassis dyno, taking the belt on & off the pump was a consistent ten hp at the tires. Probably worth 12 to 15 hp on an engine dyno. I can not imagine the vacuum pump causing a bearing problem. I also plug the bypass in the oil filter mount, so all oil goes through the filter. Keeps crap out of the bearings better. 60 psi has always been enough in mine. Ran 45 for years with zero issues. I'm no professional engine builder, so more knowledgeable pros here may have more info.
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Old 05-30-2016, 12:14 AM   #9
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Default Re: Vac pump destruction / mystery

WE use Brad Penn break in oil on our dyno a lot, but of all the break in oils we get the BP out of the engine before it goes in the car ,WE use vacuum pumps on most of race engine we build with no failures related to the vac pumps.Bill C.

Last edited by CFMCNC; 05-30-2016 at 12:20 AM.
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Old 05-30-2016, 12:47 AM   #10
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Default Re: Vac pump destruction / mystery

Your 60lbs. oil pressure. Are you taking your oil pressure reading from the rear or the front of the block? MB.
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