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Old 08-15-2013, 11:11 PM   #31
Damn Yankee
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

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Originally Posted by Jeff Lee View Post
I should never say never! Yes, I have seen Dana 60's spit out gears over the years. Nothing is infallible. Of course there's always "the rest of the story" and we'll never know if the parts had a million runs on them, were not set up correctly or the clutch was better suited for a dump truck than a race car. But I'll stick to saying I've seen more broken 9" rears than Dana's.

I looked at PerformanceBearing.com and he has 9" bearings listed but not Dana bearings. They will make any bearing you want if not listed. The 40 spline MW axle bearings are $210 a pair and that would be true if a 9" or Dana.

Door car front wheel bearings are shown as $550 approximate (I think it was $542); that's per pair. Pricing is based on application. My AMX spindle bearings cross reference to '67 (and other year) Mustang bearings. So I'm assuming a pair of wheel bearings will be in that price range for my AMX. I haven't called yet. Lamb spindle kits were around $650.

Finally, I did some research on the net. As I said, I don't follow every theory "just because so and so said so" but here's what Evan Smith apparently found:

Numbers published by Evan Smith in National Dragster show that because of the reduced offset between the pinion shaft axis and the axle centerline, the Dana 60 has LOWER drivetrain losses than either the 12-bolt or the 9-inch:

Dana 60: 5%
GM 12-Bolt: 7%
Ford 9-inch: 10%

And yes, there is as much contradictory evidence as supporting evidence on the web regarding frictional losses.
Putting together a class car where we are restricted to 8.8 or 9" Ford. Well, we can use a 7.5 too but I am really question the strength so I am not even considering it. Most everyone runs the 8.8 as it said to be more efficient than a traditional 9". However, gear ratio choices are limited and there are also no 8.8 pro gears. Have made a few calls to Wayne at Indy Gear, M/W's, and others who believe the 9" is the better route. Question is, can I make the 9" as efficient or better than the 8.8 using ceramic bearings in the pinion support, and in the carrier ?
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Old 08-18-2013, 10:25 AM   #32
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

Not to split hairs...but I thought the GM 12-bolt was regarded as the MOST efficient
rear end for many years...

That would explain why I saw several SS/AA cars sporting 'em when I last went to
Indy back in the mid-'90's!

But then again...maybe they were in there...because they were the lightest axle
assembly of the 3 types?
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Old 08-19-2013, 02:39 PM   #33
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

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Originally Posted by ss wannabee View Post
Not to split hairs...but I thought the GM 12-bolt was regarded as the MOST efficient
rear end for many years...

That would explain why I saw several SS/AA cars sporting 'em when I last went to
Indy back in the mid-'90's!

But then again...maybe they were in there...because they were the lightest axle
assembly of the 3 types?
Yes I have been told the 12" is the most efficient, however it is not allowed in this class
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Old 08-19-2013, 03:48 PM   #34
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

The 8.8 and the 12 bolt are twinkies.
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Old 01-25-2014, 07:01 AM   #35
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

Not trying to split hairs, but is there any measurable performance advantage between a ceramic angular contact bearing for the front spindle's vs a full roller ceramic bearing ?

Also is there any data showing where the angular contact bearing is less safe than a full roller bearing when upgrading to ceramics ?

I ask because the brake manufacture we are working with is giving us fits and telling us the angular ceramic bearing is unsafe with our particular spindles (1991 Mustang). I have a hard time believing this when I know there are stockers and super stockers out there in excess of 3500lbs using this very bearing. Our race weight will be 3150lbs.
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Old 01-25-2014, 12:16 PM   #36
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

I have wondered the same thing about the front bearings. Is there a load difference even on steel angular bearings when coming down off a wheelie. I look at tooling everday that is held in place by the locking friction of angles. When an angled bearing has load applied I would think it has to create a little more friction than any ball type bearing, just by design. Then there is the question about wheelies and the loading on ceramic bearings. Are they fragile?

Ed, why not put a Strange 12 bolt drop out in a 9" housing instead of replacing 9" housing with a 12 bolt housing. Class legal?
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Old 01-25-2014, 12:23 PM   #37
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

oops!
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Old 01-25-2014, 04:22 PM   #38
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

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Ed, why not put a Strange 12 bolt drop out in a 9" housing instead of replacing 9" housing with a 12 bolt housing. Class legal?
I ended up with a brand new Dewco piece from a friend who was getting out and selling everything. It had every bell and option including ceramics with a Lamb support, and the price was right for me and it helped him. Only down side is the 5:22 gears will be too much as we are RPM limited at 7700, even with the 28.5 tall tires so I will need to do a gear swap.

Thanks, Andy
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Old 01-28-2014, 01:23 PM   #39
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

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Originally Posted by ss wannabee View Post

That would explain why I saw several SS/AA cars sporting 'em when I last went to
Indy back in the mid-'90's!
1 Very fast SS/AA used a 10 bolt Chevy.

Wade
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Old 01-28-2014, 03:30 PM   #40
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Default Re: ceramic bearings

Andy sent u a PM---FED387
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