wrist pin clip issues

toolmakeron · 03-16-2014, 11:36 PM

On a 632 Chev , 14.5 engine, we found some pieces of wrist pin clips in the oil change. They are 2- .042 spirolocks.(per side) They were not excessively stretched when installed.My first thought was a bad batch of heat treated clips. I was told that because he hit the chip in the water box, this will cause this kind of problem. Engine had about 60- 75 hits on it. He (the driver) also pedals it in the top end. car is a dragster, about 2100 lbs . I was told that this also might contribute to this problem. I get my info from drag racers that have 40 years in the game & I respect their knowledge. Any input or experiences that I can learn / understand whats going on ? His last engine pounded out the clip grooves to about .030-.035 end play. Same basic engine.Same car . Thanks guys

rickseeman · 03-17-2014, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toolmakeron

On a 632 Chev , 14.5 engine, we found some pieces of wrist pin clips in the oil change. They are 2- .042 spirolocks.(per side) They were not excessively stretched when installed.My first thought was a bad batch of heat treated clips. I was told that because he hit the chip in the water box, this will cause this kind of problem. Engine had about 60- 75 hits on it. He (the driver) also pedals it in the top end. car is a dragster, about 2100 lbs . I was told that this also might contribute to this problem. I get my info from drag racers that have 40 years in the game & I respect their knowledge. Any input or experiences that I can learn / understand whats going on ? His last engine pounded out the clip grooves to about .030-.035 end play. Same basic engine.Same car . Thanks guys

There is something else going on here. Everybody in the country runs double spirolox ( which is way overkill) and doesn't have a problem and he pounds them out of 2 motors in a row? Something is way wrong.

toolmakeron · 03-17-2014, 06:11 PM

yea I know somethings very wrong, but the" fun" ? here is how to avoid it next time.The driver won't listen to me & thinks it's the engine builders fault...isn't it always? LOL

pmrphil · 03-17-2014, 08:32 PM

I've seen before when an engine is detonated hard enough it will bow the pins and push hard on the spirolox - overrev will do it also.

richie 2 · 03-19-2014, 07:08 AM

spark plugs would show signs of detonation?

toolmakeron · 03-21-2014, 01:02 AM

I haven't seen the plugs, but I was told that it's hard to see signs of detonation from alcohol engines. I don't know this, only going from what I was told. The driver / tuner would see this , I think he would know about this. I keep suspecting , on the chip in the water box. Thanks for the input guys.

Adger Smith · 03-31-2014, 02:11 AM

His alky tune up or his on & off throttle foot could be flooding the engine at some time in the run and never show up on the plugs. I'm still saying you have the combination of an abusive driver and a slightly off Alky tune up. I don't mean off at WOT. I mean off in the "Fuel Curve" when the foot is on and off the throttle.

Marine One · 04-30-2017, 02:12 PM

Have you torn it down yet to inspect for damage?

Is the damage worse on one bank vs the other? Any specific cylinders consistently worse than the others?

On the non failed clips, do they or the piston grooves show any unusual signs of wear, like four corner wear vs even wear, etc?

cjperformance · 05-02-2017, 06:39 PM

Hi all, 1st post here !
With this wrist pin damage issue, what are the rod pin bushings looking like?
Bush brand/material?
Coated pins?
AND pin/rod clearance?
I have seen where the pin clearance is too small and the pin nips in the rod, then any side movement of the piston is forcing on the pin clip and damages the clip and/or piston.

Todd Gross · 05-04-2017, 10:33 AM

I had one customers' engine that I tore down for a freshen up only to find multiple spiro loc failures. To the point of serious cylinder wall and piston damage. After digging for info I found out the previous assembler purchased his spiro locs in bulk from McMaster Carr. Needless to say the quality control ( heat treat ) may not be up to the quality of that of a Performance Piston company. I installed JE locks and 2 seasons later on freshen up, no more failures on a 700" .
I am not suggesting that that toolmakeron's engine has McMaster stuff in it, just sharing an experience*

03-16-2014, 11:36 PM	#1
toolmakeron Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 15 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	wrist pin clip issues On a 632 Chev , 14.5 engine, we found some pieces of wrist pin clips in the oil change. They are 2- .042 spirolocks.(per side) They were not excessively stretched when installed.My first thought was a bad batch of heat treated clips. I was told that because he hit the chip in the water box, this will cause this kind of problem. Engine had about 60- 75 hits on it. He (the driver) also pedals it in the top end. car is a dragster, about 2100 lbs . I was told that this also might contribute to this problem. I get my info from drag racers that have 40 years in the game & I respect their knowledge. Any input or experiences that I can learn / understand whats going on ? His last engine pounded out the clip grooves to about .030-.035 end play. Same basic engine.Same car . Thanks guys

03-17-2014, 06:11 PM	#3
toolmakeron Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 15 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: wrist pin clip issues yea I know somethings very wrong, but the" fun" ? here is how to avoid it next time.The driver won't listen to me & thinks it's the engine builders fault...isn't it always? LOL

03-17-2014, 08:32 PM	#4
pmrphil Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: CT Posts: 432 Likes: 1,469 Liked 322 Times in 137 Posts	Re: wrist pin clip issues I've seen before when an engine is detonated hard enough it will bow the pins and push hard on the spirolox - overrev will do it also. __________________ Phil Molski PMR Performance S/C 1623

03-19-2014, 07:08 AM	#5
richie 2 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 935 Likes: 361 Liked 170 Times in 78 Posts	Re: wrist pin clip issues spark plugs would show signs of detonation?

03-21-2014, 01:02 AM	#6
toolmakeron Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 15 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: wrist pin clip issues I haven't seen the plugs, but I was told that it's hard to see signs of detonation from alcohol engines. I don't know this, only going from what I was told. The driver / tuner would see this , I think he would know about this. I keep suspecting , on the chip in the water box. Thanks for the input guys.

03-31-2014, 02:11 AM	#7
Adger Smith VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Texarkana Ark/TX Posts: 2,430 Likes: 532 Liked 824 Times in 301 Posts	Re: wrist pin clip issues His alky tune up or his on & off throttle foot could be flooding the engine at some time in the run and never show up on the plugs. I'm still saying you have the combination of an abusive driver and a slightly off Alky tune up. I don't mean off at WOT. I mean off in the "Fuel Curve" when the foot is on and off the throttle. __________________ Adger Smith (Former SS)

04-30-2017, 02:12 PM	#8
Marine One Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Indiana Posts: 69 Likes: 1 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: wrist pin clip issues Have you torn it down yet to inspect for damage? Is the damage worse on one bank vs the other? Any specific cylinders consistently worse than the others? On the non failed clips, do they or the piston grooves show any unusual signs of wear, like four corner wear vs even wear, etc? __________________ Chad Sheets \| STK 319 \| 10.69 \| 1.39

05-02-2017, 06:39 PM	#9
cjperformance Junior Member Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 1 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: wrist pin clip issues Hi all, 1st post here ! With this wrist pin damage issue, what are the rod pin bushings looking like? Bush brand/material? Coated pins? AND pin/rod clearance? I have seen where the pin clearance is too small and the pin nips in the rod, then any side movement of the piston is forcing on the pin clip and damages the clip and/or piston.

05-04-2017, 10:33 AM	#10
Todd Gross Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Crete, IL Posts: 169 Likes: 237 Liked 56 Times in 24 Posts	Re: wrist pin clip issues I had one customers' engine that I tore down for a freshen up only to find multiple spiro loc failures. To the point of serious cylinder wall and piston damage. After digging for info I found out the previous assembler purchased his spiro locs in bulk from McMaster Carr. Needless to say the quality control ( heat treat ) may not be up to the quality of that of a Performance Piston company. I installed JE locks and 2 seasons later on freshen up, no more failures on a 700" . I am not suggesting that that toolmakeron's engine has McMaster stuff in it, just sharing an experience* __________________ Todd Gross 3323 FS/E,F