HOME FORUM RULES CONTACT
     
   
   

Go Back   CLASS RACER FORUM > Class Racer Forums > Stock and Super Stock Tech


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-05-2018, 11:49 PM   #1
Bill Bogues
Member
 
Bill Bogues's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Bethany La.
Posts: 317
Likes: 83
Liked 168 Times in 51 Posts
Cool Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

I've been wondering if I can do this: when nhra opened up the lifter rule allowing solid lifter in place of hyralic's, I thought it would be a good idea to try them on our 305.She turns it quite a bit higher that 7000 so I thought their might be something there.I was concerned about running them on the same cam but in the Comp master lobe chart it said the lobe profiles we were running would work with solid or Promagnum hydralic lifters.Since most of today's racing hydralic lifters are basically solid I thought I would try it out.It seemed to help with top end mph Quite a bit.My question is does anyone think I can zero lash the solid lifters? Since I zero lash the hydralics I can't see how it would hurt to try it on the solid's.Called comp today and they didn't seem to think It will work, but why would they put it in their catalog chart saying you could run both.I'd appreciate any thought on this.
__________________
Bill Bogues 4696 STK
Bill Bogues is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 04:41 AM   #2
D. Hake 4459
Junior Member
 
D. Hake 4459's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Muskogee, Oklahoma
Posts: 83
Likes: 56
Liked 2 Times in 1 Post
Default Re: Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

When you zero lash the hydraulic lifters is there any travel left in the lifter or is that bottomed in the lifter? If there is travel left in the lifter, there is your lash. I would think if you zero lashed a solid lifter when everything heats up it would wind up holding the valves open a little. I may be thinking backwards, it is pretty late. Derek
__________________
Derek Hake 4459 H/SA 69' Roadrunner
D. Hake 4459 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 08:46 AM   #3
nhramnl
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 504
Likes: 7
Liked 352 Times in 82 Posts
Default Re: Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

I think Derek is right. If you put the lash at zero with a solid lifter, when things warm up and expand, you will either bend pushrods or hold the valves open. Lash exists to allow for the clearance change that occurs when things go from cold to hot.
nhramnl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 10:59 AM   #4
t.tosto
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 151
Likes: 104
Liked 61 Times in 22 Posts
Default Re: Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

While on this subject, new to me is hyd. lifter combo, 255/350. With Shubeck hyd. lifters, what procedure is recommended to set valves with respect to preload. Always ran solid lifter B/B before, many thanks for any response, Tony Tosto.
t.tosto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 11:52 AM   #5
Alan Nyhus
VIP Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lower Dakota territory
Posts: 1,162
Likes: 1,012
Liked 761 Times in 225 Posts
Default Re: Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Bogues View Post
My question is does anyone think I can zero lash the solid lifters? Since I zero lash the hydralics I can't see how it would hurt to try it on the solid's.Called comp today and they didn't seem to think It will work, but why would they put it in their catalog chart saying you could run both.I'd appreciate any thought on this.
Bill, the lash tightens up .002-.003 on an iron head/iron block SBC (cold to hot), so keep that in mind. -Al
__________________
"That'll never work....."
Alan Nyhus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 12:32 PM   #6
Bill Bogues
Member
 
Bill Bogues's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Bethany La.
Posts: 317
Likes: 83
Liked 168 Times in 51 Posts
Smile Re: Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

Thanks guys for replies,I' tried lash settings from .008 to .012 and was wondering just how close I could run . I noticed when checking cam lift that I lost a noticable amount of lift by running that much lash so that's why thought about tightning it up.(ex. .010 x1.5= .015 lift lost).It sure is fun doing crazy stuff like this but I believe it's going to fall by wayside in not too distant future.
__________________
Bill Bogues 4696 STK
Bill Bogues is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 04:34 PM   #7
jmantle
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Black Creek, BC Canada
Posts: 311
Likes: 62
Liked 135 Times in 66 Posts
Default Re: Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

Quote:
Originally Posted by t.tosto View Post
While on this subject, new to me is hyd. lifter combo, 255/350. With Shubeck hyd. lifters, what procedure is recommended to set valves with respect to preload. Always ran solid lifter B/B before, many thanks for any response, Tony Tosto.
I've been running .006" cold with Shubecks. They tighten up .003/.004 hot so I still have some lash.

Jim Mantle V/SA 6632
jmantle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 07:40 PM   #8
Greg Reimer 7376
VIP Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Glendora,Calif.
Posts: 1,108
Likes: 164
Liked 644 Times in 205 Posts
Cool Re: Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

Some variables exist between motors,even of the same brand and even configuration. Valve lash can be affected by numerous things. Probably the best way to weed out some variables would be to carefully set valve lash cold,knowing exactly where you set it, running the engine to operating temp, then checking it hot. Now, operating temp at the end of a hard pass would be hotter than a 10 minute warm up.That would affect exhaust valve lash more than intake because of the greater heat of the exhaust gas passing the valve.The important thing is to know exactly how much the lash tightens up between temperature extremes. The main thing is to still have .002-.003"lash at the heat extreme.
You definitely need to find the fine line between loose valves and lost lift,and tight valves, lost power and compression loss due to valves not seating at the finish line. If adding that much lash caused that much loss of lift, maybe you should try a set of pushrods that are .030"-.050" longer. That would work with the engine's valve train geometry to bring the lift into an optimal setting. Also, too much lash with Schubeck lifters kind of scares me with some of the stories about the ceramic base of the lifters failing. You need to compare cold lash with hot lash on that particular engine you're racing and working on in order to determine exactly what works. A good motor is like a good woman. It will talk to you and you can figure out exactly what it wants. They can both get quite loud at times,however.
Greg Reimer 7376 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 08:27 PM   #9
Dissident
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Colorado hills
Posts: 123
Likes: 11
Liked 73 Times in 36 Posts
Default Re: Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

Setting valve lash with a "feeler" gage can easily be all over the map when it comes to accuracy. Depending on valve train deflection, a racer might want to more precisely set the valve lash with either an old P&G valve gapper or one of the more recent pieces from Precision Measurement Supply in San Antonio.
Regards,
Dissident
Hope the pics attached ok.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCN0071.JPG
Views:	246
Size:	304.6 KB
ID:	43925   Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCN0075.JPG
Views:	281
Size:	318.0 KB
ID:	43926  
Dissident is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 10:27 PM   #10
MikeMoller
Senior Member
 
MikeMoller's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Raleigh NC
Posts: 626
Likes: 27
Liked 242 Times in 72 Posts
Default Re: Cam&Lifter& valvelash?

Wondering about the loss of lift running solid lifter. If you have to run lash but the cam is checked at zero lash by NHRA then you would have to lose some lift using solids. Question is, do you lose lift with a hydraulic lifter at zero lash or with some preload, and how much? Then is a solid lifter really the way to go?
__________________
Mike Moller
NHRA 203 Q-R-T/SA
MikeMoller is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright © Class Racer.com. All Rights Reserved. Designated trademarks and brands are the property of their respective owners.