Could Super Modified been different if?

[larry dowty]

ed that is funny when they droped mod. i went sprint car racing myself 360 asphalt car in the nw till i went crazy also and came back told my wife drag racing was cheaper she damn near divorced me LOL alan falcone and me had a great time with the sprint cars he has had alot more success than me winning the SS div. title in div. 6

[blkjack]

Originally Posted by BlueOval Ralph

On more thing take a look at this web site
http://www.boss302.com/smf/index.php?topic=25741.0

Aslo this site it has some pictures of the car at Hardys in December 74 when it was picked up

There is a pic of Arlen putting it on the bumper. The poster said his wheelie bars failed. LOL what wheelie bars? Garley Daniels used to put his on the bumper regularly.

[Robert Swartz]

Interesting class to revisit. Could the concept be revived? The 10.5 tire class of the 70's could become the 10.5 tire class of today. Good winter conversation thread.


If you look at the rules, they kind of mirror the IHRA crate motor class but would allow different cylinder heads and roller cams. The heads would be an issue. It was mentioned on another post, a way around this might be a claimer rule. This has worked for the local stock car classes. Why couldn't it be applied to drag racing? We all talk about the costs, it would take some starch out of the money boys, lose a couple of expensive motors. Would the competition be equal, I doubt it but it might level the playing field some for us lo-buck types.

Just to add to the conversation, what about car types? I'm looking at this from the perspective of suspensions. If we had the same type of rules as stock, that limits the types of cars allowed to compete. Would there be an allowance for front wheel drive conversions? How would those be handled? Hate to muddy the waters but just throwing some thoughts out there.

[Rick Voegelin]

A friend pointed me toward this thread. Reading the posts brought back many memories, and stirred up some long-forgotten brain cells. Apologies in advance for this long and rambling post.

I was inspired to look at moldy old issues of Car Craft and NHRA rulebooks to trace the class' history. The original idea of Pro Modified (that's what we called it) was born when John Dianna (then the CC editor) and I were driving his transporter from Bowling Green to Detroit. Car Craft had played a key role in the Econorail concept (back then it was an obsolete front-engine dragster with a small-block and an automatic trans, not the purpose-built dragsters of today), and we came up with a similar doorslammer class. We pitched our idea to NHRA National Tech Director Jim Dale. Dale told us that if there was enough racer support for the idea, he'd consider it.

The first article appeared in July 1974 CC titled "Cutting the High Cost of Racing." (The US was in another recession back then, and money was tight.) The introduction laid out the idea: "Drag racing needs an eliminator bracket which encourages racers to build fast, exciting cars on a low budget. It needs a place for sportsmen who would like to campaign a heads-up, stock-bodied car without committing the financial suicide of going Pro Stock racing. It needs a bracket which spectators will pay to see, and which track operators can run without courting bankruptcy."

Based loosely on the AHRA GT3 class, CC proposed a Pro Modified class at 10 lbs/ci, 1967 or later body, single four-barrel, production cylinder heads, and 12" tires. We put a survey in the magazine for racers to fill out and send, and ran regular updates in following issues. I took two notebooks filled with racer letters and surveys to NHRA headquarters and dumped them on Dale's desk. "There's your response!" I told him.

NHRA bought the concept, but not the details. Instead of a separate heads-up eliminator, the class became part of Modified in 1975. NHRA renamed it A/Super Modified, and specified 9 lbs/in, 2850 lbs. minimum weight (without driver), 366ci maximum, and 10.5" tires. Not more than 50 percent of total weight could be on rear wheels. Only three A/SM cars made the 1975 Winternationals, but by Indy, there were more than 20 in class eliminations. The index was 10.65 as I recall.

In 1976, NHRA expanded Super Modified to three classes: A/SM (8.5 lbs/ci, big-block wedge or canted valve, 850 cfm carb, 11.5" tires, 3350 lbs. minimum with driver); B/SM (9.50 lbs/ci, 3000 lbs. minimum with driver, small-block wedge only, 750 cfm, 10.5" tire); and C/SM (10.50 lbs/ci, otherwise same as B/SM). I believe the respective indexes were 10.40 for A/SM, 10.60 for B/SM, and 10.80 for C/SM. That year at Indy, there were 31 cars in C/SM, and it took five rounds to make Monday's Modified show.

There were no significant rule changes for 1977, but in 1978 A/SM was opened up to allow Hemi and small-block engines, and non-production factory heads were allowed in A/SM and B/SM (permitting 292 turbo heads in Chevys). C/SM was reserved for production wedge heads only, effectively eliminating the Cleveland Mavericks from the class. NHRA also factored the canted valve Fords with a .2 lb/ci penalty (not the right thing to do, but they'd set the precedent with weight breaks for Pro Stocks based on engine type). Cars with automatic transmissions got a 150-pound weight break.

As others have mentioned, many great racers competed in the Super Mod classes over the years. To name just a few: Ray Allen (Truppi/Kling Chevy II), Garley Daniels (C/SM Chevy II), Larry Nelson (Jeg's Chevy II), Mike Cook (C/SM Camaro), Rick Houser (B/SM Chevy II), FJ Smith (B/SM Camaro), Ron Anderson (B/SM Maverick), Jim Ehlen (B/SM Mustang), Dempsey Hardy (C/SM Chevy II), Mike Keener (A/SM Camaro), Steve Nolan (A/SM Nova), Rick McGinnis (C/SM Camaro), Don Bowles (A/SM Fairmont), Mike Edwards (B/SM Maverick), Jim Stevens (B/SM Maverick) and many, many more. (Sorry if I've got cars and classes incorrect, a lot of brain cells have died since then.)

In my opinion, Super Mod died when NHRA killed Modified eliminator at the end of the 1981 season and the classes were split between Super Stock and Comp. When I look at what Super Mod has become, I just shake my head. While I am amazed at how fast the Super Mod cars run and I respect what the racers have accomplished, the current generation of cars is light years away from the original idea of affordable, heads-up racing.

Thanks for the memories,
Rick Voegelin

[larry dowty]

ed you were right, i talked with steve nolan at breakfast this morning and mike was in B/SM as rick just posted ( hi rick ) that was some good times had buy all.

[blkjack]

Originally Posted by blkjack

Maybe it was the demise of Modified Eliminator itself that made the "wheels come off" the class.

n my opinion, Super Mod died when NHRA killed Modified eliminator at the end of the 1981 season and the classes were split between Super Stock and Comp. When I look at what Super Mod has become, I just shake my head. While I am amazed at how fast the Super Mod cars run and I respect what the racers have accomplished, the current generation of cars is light years away from the original idea of affordable, heads-up racing.

Thanks for the memories,
Rick Voegelin

I guess we are in total agreement Rick. Today's SM cars are not much different than today's Altereds ( more or less a chassis car)

[Ed Carpenter]

Originally Posted by BlueOval Ralph

This post shows how stupid people can be, pull a head on one side to check for porting and check the stroke on the other side--- Why would you do some thing like this but if you have the head off one side and were to check the stroke on all four cylinders the other bank would be the same
pass side---------------drivers side
4----------------------------8
3----------------------------7
2----------------------------6
1----------------------------5
the above chart shows which cylinders are on same journal fo crank just this about this if the Tech guys were not smart enough to figure this out???






Originally Posted by FED 387
Well I had it kinda right hell it was about 30-35 years ago-we pitted next to Vogelin at the Winters first big race for that car---it was basically a car straight from a used car lot with motor/trans/wheels added-only ran Ihra part of one season-we ran M/P anyway and tore down Fadely every chance we got ,more of a harassment kinda thing than actually looking for anything--hell we new he was legal just snooping--we made him take off door upholstery panels /pull a head on one side to check for porting and check the stroke on the other side---

Why do people have to get personal on these forums and call people stupid????

[Ed Carpenter]

Originally Posted by Ed Wright

Why don't you ask Jim Stevens about something? After being qualified #3 at that Amarillo race you mentioned, Ricky Smith helpped Jim do something, looked like change a carb, before the last round of qualifying and picking up about a tenth which bumped me to 3rd. Why did he drive right by the scales? I was on the scales when he drove by, I asked the IHRA official there "Aren't you going to make him weigh?". His reply was "He has been weighing all day, he's OK." That was the last friggin IHRA race I ran.
I watched some stuff being put back into the car after we got back to the pits. And the carb was evidently changed back. Jim had slowed back down on Sunday. I got to race Ricky in the semis, Jim & Ricky got to have an all Ford (Whoopee!) final.

Ask him why he didn't weigh with the rest of us. Guesing Ricky told him he could get away with it. IHRA tech doesn't seem to be so lame now, at least as far as I can tell.

Watch it Ed someone on here is going to call you a old liar!!! LMAO

[Ed Wright]

Originally Posted by deuces wild

Watch it Ed someone on here is going to call you a old liar!!! LMAO

Ed, I was not the only one to see it.

[MOTORSPORTS Innovations]

I ran A in 75 with a 67 Mustang with 351 Cleveland. NHRA decided that was not legal with the 351 Cleveland block not being stock configuration.

In 76 I started running C with a 67 Camaro - I was moderately competitive (usually wend 3-4 rounds at the Summernationals and did on at Atco & Englishtown weekly Modified eliminator.

Getting back to the OP question what killed the deal for me was when Jimmy Miller (from somewhere around West Chester PA) bought Garley Daniels Silver 67 Chevy II. That car was at least .2 faster than my car. Garley came up once a year to E-town and that was fine but with that car here every week took the wind out of my sails. I did order a set of the state of the art heads with *** valves etc fo the next year but wisely canceled them in favor of raising a family.