Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage - Page 4

Bart Kilraine · 05-14-2010, 11:20 AM

Stock and Super Stock will still draw more spectators than a bracket race {test n tune draws more than them}.Stock and S/S still have rules to follow,like making it fast with what you have and allowed within the [bent rules]....So before you put us out to pasture,be careful what takes our place,it might be the demise of Drag Racing as we know it!

Evan Smith · 05-14-2010, 12:02 PM

Bob,

I have not done any calculations. There are far too many sanctioning bodies with heads-up Class rules to count them, but believe me, there are a lot of racers racing in various Class formats, who don't run NHRA or IHRA. In fact, many NHRA racers have done quite well racing in some of those classes. That is not a knock on our type of racing, or NHRA or IHRA, but our classes are built around factory vehicles with factory combinations. There is an allure to what we do, but it has its limitations. This is coming form a hardcore Stock racer. And even the purist in me thinks that we might need to think outside the box for our form of racing to survive.

Bart,

I beg to differ, I've been to many NMCA and NMRA racers and they get as many or more fans than a typical points race. If you want to see, get up right now and go to Atco, the NMRA is there this weekend and you will see great racing with RULES and TECH INSPECTION and TEARDOWNS. You can even race your Cougar.

The cars are current, they represent what people are driving and doing with street cars today (which is where the majority of performance parts is sold, contrary to popular belief), it's what they read about in magazines and see on TV, plus there are cool car shows, vendors where they can buy actual hot rod parts and ticket prices are generally less than NHRA.

No one is putting us out to pasture, NHRA Stock and SS will be around for a long time to come, but we have to realize that many of us race OLD cars that younger generations can't relate to. And quite frankly, the new stuff is exciting, the cars are very fast and fun to watch.

Evan

Bart Kilraine · 05-14-2010, 12:17 PM

Evan, .re read my first line, talking about bracket format only and spectators. I like NMCA ect......,as long as it has rules especialy HP to weight ,.....Hell, even crate motors !

X-TECH MAN · 05-14-2010, 12:18 PM

[QUOTE=Evan Smith,...... And quite frankly, the new stuff is exciting, the cars are very fast and fun to watch.

Evan[/QUOTE]

Its ALL a matter of opinion ! Like basketball....I wouldnt flip the TV remote to watch any of it.

Evan Smith · 05-14-2010, 01:15 PM

Terry,

You may not like the styles of the cars, but no matter how you slice it, wheels-up, bumper draggin', side-by-side racing is exciting.

Evan

Harry 6674 · 05-14-2010, 02:27 PM

Heads up,no break out will always outdraw shoe polish. Unless your in the car shoe polish is boring to watch.

bill dedman · 05-23-2010, 01:48 AM

If you want to see how current-day magazines compare with the titles that existed in the heyday of Super Stock, do yourself a favor, get on ebay, and buy some old copies of Hot Rod, or Car Craft from the '62-'70 era, particularly the earlier stuff.

I believe I have owned a copy of every ("Petersen," et al) "Hot Rod" magazine published since about 1954, and the editorial content of that magazine was peerless, to this day, during that '62-'70 era.

They had Jim McFarland, Ray Brock, some guy named "Racer" Brown, and a few other really good writers who would devote several pages to EACH NEW ENGINE (such as the new 413/426 Max Wedge Mopars, the 409's, and the S/S Ford FE motors [406/427/428CJ]), when they were released, and would take an example completely apart, and spread the (sizeaable) photos out grandly, showing the special, new-design heads, manifolding, bottom end mods, and anything else that was significant in the power-making department, for each engine!

When is the last time you saw an article with such an extensive technical explanation, including beaucoup photographs of a disassembled new-design engine, with pertinent comments from the elite racers of the day, RE the imagined potential of these new engines?

I could not WAIT to get my hands on those issues!!! Petersen didn't need to put Garlits on the cover to get ME to pay newsstand price (although, to be fair, I always subscribed... still do) for an issue!!!!

During the forty-plus years since that scenario was the norm, has the reading audience "dumbed down" to the extent that they can't appreciate or, even, understand technically-oriented editorial content such as this? Has the attention span of the average 20-year-old drag racer deteriorated to the extent that all this technical information would be wasted on him/her?

It was exciting as hell, back in '62.... Has the ensuing 48 years resulted in the demise of the intellect of potential drag racers? Is that why we don't see articles like that any more?

God knows, the '08 CJ's, the DP Challengers, and the recently released efforts by Ford have surely contained a ton of exciting, new, technical information that is ripe for dispersal to the information-hungry racers among us.

Where is it? I don't mean a few self-serving, "factory" press releases; I mean the articles like Hot Rod used to generate.... pages and pages of tech data and photographs of components. What we called, "the good stuff!!!"

On a different tack....

I need confirmation from someone who was there, or who knows: What I heard was that in its final weeks/months, Petersen Publishing (if, in fact, it was still "Petersen" at that time), dispatched Johnny Dianna to Alexandria, VA to shut down Petersen's recently-purchased Super Stock and DRAG ILLUSTRATED.

I'd like to know of that's true.

Was the little SS& DI such a threat to the mega-conglomerate "Petersen" machine that they couldn't stand the competition????

Un-f-ing believeable, IF that's true (that they bought it in order to shut it down.)

If they had done that and replaced it with a similar title (RE: content,) that would be one thing.... but, they didn't. They just left us hanging.

We're still hanging,.

Thanks to John D. for his efforts to give us a hand. I'm gonna give HIM a hand by sending in a subscription, this coming week. Look for it, John....

Can anybody confirm or deny this Dianna story? I noticed that Johnny left "Petersen" shortly thereafter... probably with a bad taste in his mouth. He was, after all, a Stock Eliminator racer before he took up writing for a living.

Terry mirrors my thoughts and attitude totally; we must have the same astrological signs. LOL!

I am showing my thoughts and feelings for NHRA and the way they treat Sportsman racers by letting my membership lapse (first time in over 40 years) and building a hi-boost '64 Valiant Slant 6 car just to have fun with. I know; Uncle Tom won't miss my money....

X-TECH MAN · 05-23-2010, 07:22 AM

Yes Bill.....The average younger male has no interest in the older generations car culture. The majority prefer the s##t boxes with fart can mufflers or a 4 wheel drive pickup jacked up so far as to make your nose bleed. . Just about the only younger guys drag racing a stocker or super stock car these days is the off spring of an older car guy like us. I doubt you will ever see a "Magazine" car like the 413 Plymouth Ray Brock ran in 1962 for Hot Rod Magazine. Can you imagine Super Ford Magazine competing with a 2010 blown Mustang and they even have a good stocker racer on their staff. Never happen in todays world. It is what it is today. Thats why I subscribe to Corvette Fever and Rod and Custom mags today.

John Quinn · 05-23-2010, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X-TECH MAN

Yes Bill.....The average younger male has no interest in the older generations car culture. The majority prefer the s##t boxes with fart can mufflers or a 4 wheel drive pickup jacked up so far as to make your nose bleed. . Just about the only younger guys drag racing a stocker or super stock car these days is the off spring of an older car guy like us. I doubt you will ever see a "Magazine" car like the 413 Plymouth Ray Brock ran in 1962 for Hot Rod Magazine. Can you imagine Super Ford Magazine competing with a 2010 blown Mustang and they even have a good stocker racer on their staff. Never happen in todays world. It is what it is today. Thats why I subscribe to Corvette Fever and Rod and Custom mags today.

The younger generation have their own car culture and it is not imports. The import racing scene just about disappeared once they found out drag racing is expensive and requires hard work.

There are several sanctioning organizations that sponsor racing events comprised of several heads up classes of bodied cars along with handicap racing classes for those wanting that sort of thing. The heads up class rules reflect what the younger crowd wants and unfortunatly (or not) i is not nhra classes. They like power adders and modified suspensions and stock appearing bodies. If they ran some races nearer the middle of the country I would join them. I prefer running all motor but I can adapt unlike most of my fellow old farts. I have to admit it would be a lot easier building a car to their rules because it does not require innovative interpretation of the rules (cheating) to be competitive, Just to be clear, I do not think most of the class racers are cheating but I am sure some of them are, I know what to do the make a pair of "stock" cylinder heads cost thousands of dollars and go faster than most but I choose not to go there

I have seen some articles about the new class engines but they are not very in depth, probably because there is not a lot of interest in NHRA style racing among their readers.

Then there is Mustang racing. There is even a sanctioning body just for mustangs. You GM and Mopar guys don't wat to see this so you dont.

Ken Miele · 05-23-2010, 12:59 PM

Here is another spin on NHRA Sportsman Racing. Although sanctioning bodies like NMCA and NMRA a very cool and offer an alternative to NHRA, they do not bring as many cars at a typical national event. They may bring as many fans but with 12-15 classes to choose from at a NMCA or NMRA race they usually bring in about 200-250 cars. Most classes average 10 cars per class excluding the brackets, that will have 40 plus cars.

I have been to these races and there are cool, but the atmosphere is totally different, not a in a bad way, just different. NHRA will typically bring in about 300-350 cars with only 5-6 classes. Although some may think NHRA sportsman racing is doomed with all the new cars and strict rules, they still command a good part of the sportsman racing.

Chrysler and Ford getting involved NHRA sportsman racing shows me they feel there is a market for their products. They have access to all the demographics like any big corporation would have and they feel its worth getting involved in.

Magazines only offer one part of the exposure for racing and we many not get the coverage we should, but there are other places to get exposure. I think the internet has opened up more avenues and has giving sportsman's racing more coverage and helps keep sportsman racing alive and hopefully growing.

05-14-2010, 11:20 AM	#31
Bart Kilraine Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Carrolltown,PA Posts: 118 Likes: 0 Liked 11 Times in 6 Posts	Re: Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage Stock and Super Stock will still draw more spectators than a bracket race {test n tune draws more than them}.Stock and S/S still have rules to follow,like making it fast with what you have and allowed within the [bent rules]....So before you put us out to pasture,be careful what takes our place,it might be the demise of Drag Racing as we know it!

05-14-2010, 12:02 PM	#32
Evan Smith Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Tampa Posts: 400 Likes: 7 Liked 115 Times in 5 Posts	Re: Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage Bob, I have not done any calculations. There are far too many sanctioning bodies with heads-up Class rules to count them, but believe me, there are a lot of racers racing in various Class formats, who don't run NHRA or IHRA. In fact, many NHRA racers have done quite well racing in some of those classes. That is not a knock on our type of racing, or NHRA or IHRA, but our classes are built around factory vehicles with factory combinations. There is an allure to what we do, but it has its limitations. This is coming form a hardcore Stock racer. And even the purist in me thinks that we might need to think outside the box for our form of racing to survive. Bart, I beg to differ, I've been to many NMCA and NMRA racers and they get as many or more fans than a typical points race. If you want to see, get up right now and go to Atco, the NMRA is there this weekend and you will see great racing with RULES and TECH INSPECTION and TEARDOWNS. You can even race your Cougar. The cars are current, they represent what people are driving and doing with street cars today (which is where the majority of performance parts is sold, contrary to popular belief), it's what they read about in magazines and see on TV, plus there are cool car shows, vendors where they can buy actual hot rod parts and ticket prices are generally less than NHRA. No one is putting us out to pasture, NHRA Stock and SS will be around for a long time to come, but we have to realize that many of us race OLD cars that younger generations can't relate to. And quite frankly, the new stuff is exciting, the cars are very fast and fun to watch. Evan __________________ Evan Smith 1798 STK Last edited by Evan Smith; 05-14-2010 at 12:04 PM.

05-14-2010, 12:17 PM	#33
Bart Kilraine Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Carrolltown,PA Posts: 118 Likes: 0 Liked 11 Times in 6 Posts	Re: Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage Evan, .re read my first line, talking about bracket format only and spectators. I like NMCA ect......,as long as it has rules especialy HP to weight ,.....Hell, even crate motors !

05-14-2010, 12:18 PM	#34
X-TECH MAN Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lake Placid, Florida Posts: 3,203 Likes: 1,047 Liked 235 Times in 110 Posts	Re: Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage [QUOTE=Evan Smith,...... And quite frankly, the new stuff is exciting, the cars are very fast and fun to watch. Evan[/QUOTE] Its ALL a matter of opinion ! Like basketball....I wouldnt flip the TV remote to watch any of it. Last edited by X-TECH MAN; 05-14-2010 at 01:48 PM.

05-14-2010, 01:15 PM	#35
Evan Smith Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Tampa Posts: 400 Likes: 7 Liked 115 Times in 5 Posts	Re: Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage Terry, You may not like the styles of the cars, but no matter how you slice it, wheels-up, bumper draggin', side-by-side racing is exciting. Evan __________________ Evan Smith 1798 STK

05-14-2010, 02:27 PM	#36
Harry 6674 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 589 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage Heads up,no break out will always outdraw shoe polish. Unless your in the car shoe polish is boring to watch.

05-23-2010, 01:48 AM	#37
bill dedman VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Conway, AR Posts: 1,739 Likes: 0 Liked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Re: Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage If you want to see how current-day magazines compare with the titles that existed in the heyday of Super Stock, do yourself a favor, get on ebay, and buy some old copies of Hot Rod, or Car Craft from the '62-'70 era, particularly the earlier stuff. I believe I have owned a copy of every ("Petersen," et al) "Hot Rod" magazine published since about 1954, and the editorial content of that magazine was peerless, to this day, during that '62-'70 era. They had Jim McFarland, Ray Brock, some guy named "Racer" Brown, and a few other really good writers who would devote several pages to EACH NEW ENGINE (such as the new 413/426 Max Wedge Mopars, the 409's, and the S/S Ford FE motors [406/427/428CJ]), when they were released, and would take an example completely apart, and spread the (sizeaable) photos out grandly, showing the special, new-design heads, manifolding, bottom end mods, and anything else that was significant in the power-making department, for each engine! When is the last time you saw an article with such an extensive technical explanation, including beaucoup photographs of a disassembled new-design engine, with pertinent comments from the elite racers of the day, RE the imagined potential of these new engines? I could not WAIT to get my hands on those issues!!! Petersen didn't need to put Garlits on the cover to get ME to pay newsstand price (although, to be fair, I always subscribed... still do) for an issue!!!! During the forty-plus years since that scenario was the norm, has the reading audience "dumbed down" to the extent that they can't appreciate or, even, understand technically-oriented editorial content such as this? Has the attention span of the average 20-year-old drag racer deteriorated to the extent that all this technical information would be wasted on him/her? It was exciting as hell, back in '62.... Has the ensuing 48 years resulted in the demise of the intellect of potential drag racers? Is that why we don't see articles like that any more? God knows, the '08 CJ's, the DP Challengers, and the recently released efforts by Ford have surely contained a ton of exciting, new, technical information that is ripe for dispersal to the information-hungry racers among us. Where is it? I don't mean a few self-serving, "factory" press releases; I mean the articles like Hot Rod used to generate.... pages and pages of tech data and photographs of components. What we called, "the good stuff!!!" On a different tack.... I need confirmation from someone who was there, or who knows: What I heard was that in its final weeks/months, Petersen Publishing (if, in fact, it was still "Petersen" at that time), dispatched Johnny Dianna to Alexandria, VA to shut down Petersen's recently-purchased Super Stock and DRAG ILLUSTRATED. I'd like to know of that's true. Was the little SS& DI such a threat to the mega-conglomerate "Petersen" machine that they couldn't stand the competition???? Un-f-ing believeable, IF that's true (that they bought it in order to shut it down.) If they had done that and replaced it with a similar title (RE: content,) that would be one thing.... but, they didn't. They just left us hanging. We're still hanging,. Thanks to John D. for his efforts to give us a hand. I'm gonna give HIM a hand by sending in a subscription, this coming week. Look for it, John.... Can anybody confirm or deny this Dianna story? I noticed that Johnny left "Petersen" shortly thereafter... probably with a bad taste in his mouth. He was, after all, a Stock Eliminator racer before he took up writing for a living. Terry mirrors my thoughts and attitude totally; we must have the same astrological signs. LOL! I am showing my thoughts and feelings for NHRA and the way they treat Sportsman racers by letting my membership lapse (first time in over 40 years) and building a hi-boost '64 Valiant Slant 6 car just to have fun with. I know; Uncle Tom won't miss my money.... __________________ Bill Last edited by bill dedman; 05-23-2010 at 10:16 AM.

05-23-2010, 07:22 AM	#38
X-TECH MAN Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lake Placid, Florida Posts: 3,203 Likes: 1,047 Liked 235 Times in 110 Posts	Re: Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage Yes Bill.....The average younger male has no interest in the older generations car culture. The majority prefer the s##t boxes with fart can mufflers or a 4 wheel drive pickup jacked up so far as to make your nose bleed. . Just about the only younger guys drag racing a stocker or super stock car these days is the off spring of an older car guy like us. I doubt you will ever see a "Magazine" car like the 413 Plymouth Ray Brock ran in 1962 for Hot Rod Magazine. Can you imagine Super Ford Magazine competing with a 2010 blown Mustang and they even have a good stocker racer on their staff. Never happen in todays world. It is what it is today. Thats why I subscribe to Corvette Fever and Rod and Custom mags today.

05-23-2010, 12:59 PM	#40
Ken Miele Live Reporter Join Date: Dec 2000 Posts: 4,861 Likes: 456 Liked 16,554 Times in 1,522 Posts	Re: Lack Of S/SS Magazine Coverage Here is another spin on NHRA Sportsman Racing. Although sanctioning bodies like NMCA and NMRA a very cool and offer an alternative to NHRA, they do not bring as many cars at a typical national event. They may bring as many fans but with 12-15 classes to choose from at a NMCA or NMRA race they usually bring in about 200-250 cars. Most classes average 10 cars per class excluding the brackets, that will have 40 plus cars. I have been to these races and there are cool, but the atmosphere is totally different, not a in a bad way, just different. NHRA will typically bring in about 300-350 cars with only 5-6 classes. Although some may think NHRA sportsman racing is doomed with all the new cars and strict rules, they still command a good part of the sportsman racing. Chrysler and Ford getting involved NHRA sportsman racing shows me they feel there is a market for their products. They have access to all the demographics like any big corporation would have and they feel its worth getting involved in. Magazines only offer one part of the exposure for racing and we many not get the coverage we should, but there are other places to get exposure. I think the internet has opened up more avenues and has giving sportsman's racing more coverage and helps keep sportsman racing alive and hopefully growing.