My Teardown @ St Louis..... - Page 2

herbjr · 05-02-2010, 07:29 AM

Wade I seriously doubt .06 lift on the cam is going to effect the ET of the car. If your stuff is fast now it will be next week. If anyone looks at you in a bad way they really need to look in the mirror.

Herb Jr

Billy Nees · 05-02-2010, 07:48 AM

Wade, I think that everyone on here will agree that you should consider this your initiation!
Welcome to the NHRA! Now you're official!

X-TECH MAN · 05-02-2010, 07:52 AM

I found a few that were like this in my early days with IHRA. After I explaned what tech looked for and how cams were checked we had very few problems later on. Its no big deal and just fix the minor problem and go on. The lite bottom ends and doctored up heads and intakes are a far greater problem for tech to deal with. Your fellow racers and tech wont "Hang" you for it.

Robert Swartz · 05-02-2010, 08:04 AM

Wade,

Like the consensus says, fix the problem and move on. You're not the first to get bounced for tech. The guys I ran with in the 70's lost a class win at Indy due to a bad cam. My take, the key to something like this is what you learn from it.

bob3240 · 05-02-2010, 08:05 AM

I need to throw in my 2 cents worth on this. The dial indicator must be exactly parallel to the travel of the valve to read correctly. The least error in angle will cause the indicator to read a longer path than the valve travel. It's like the long side of a triangle. You can check this on a lathe or mill with a digital readout. set the indicator a little out of line and see the difference in readings you get. Hey, Wade , you're still going to have one of the baddest stockers in the land. Don't feel bad, carry on !! Bob Michael

Tom Moock · 05-02-2010, 08:43 AM

Darrin, they use pumped up for length, Bob^3240 Wayne use`s a razor blade between the the spring and the retainer to place dial indicator on to check lift, last time mine was checked at Topeka. Tom

Jim Wahl · 05-02-2010, 10:18 AM

Had the same thing happen when I set the record at Bradenton many years ago. It was with the FWD Caddy. The cam in FWD is allowed to be .430 or more if it came stock with more lift. I checked .432 on the exhaust several times. Did .002 make a performance difference? Nah, but rules are rules. Bill Holt was the guy who did the checking and schooled me in lifter, push rod, and rocker differential and gave me all the slack he could. No good! I was bounced but I learned a lot that day. Put this behind you. It happens to all of us at one time or another who compete seriously. Jim

art leong · 05-02-2010, 12:11 PM

In overhead cam motors sinking the valves,grinding the tips, or putting new valves in changes the measured cam lift.

Walker4108 · 05-02-2010, 10:05 PM

Wade you are a true class act. Most guys would blame everybody under the sun. I know you and Alky Alex will get to work and you'll comeback scary fast.

Walt

Travis Miller · 05-02-2010, 10:35 PM

The following is printed in the 2010 NHRA rulebook under Stock - Camshaft.

<"...Lift checked at valve retainer, with zero lash. Hydraulic lifter cam will be checked with pushrod and rocker as run, plus solid lifter, at zero lash. Plunger height of checking lifter will match extended height (no preload) of hydraulic lifter.">

In teardown we match the total overall height of the checking lifter to the hydraulic lifter without preload. We even have a special tool for matching the total lifter/pushrod length. We also make sure the dial indicator is operating parallel with the valve stem by lining it up in all directions.

Travis

(Disclaimer: Opinions expressed by me on this forum are exactly that, my opinions.)

05-02-2010, 07:29 AM	#11
herbjr VIP Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Greensboro NC Posts: 1,027 Likes: 1 Liked 83 Times in 32 Posts	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... Wade I seriously doubt .06 lift on the cam is going to effect the ET of the car. If your stuff is fast now it will be next week. If anyone looks at you in a bad way they really need to look in the mirror. Herb Jr

05-02-2010, 07:48 AM	#12
Billy Nees VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: On a hilltop in Pa. Posts: 4,278 Likes: 3,189 Liked 6,963 Times in 1,569 Posts	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... Wade, I think that everyone on here will agree that you should consider this your initiation! Welcome to the NHRA! Now you're official! __________________ Billy Nees 1188 STK, SS What is "NORMAL"???

05-02-2010, 07:52 AM	#13
X-TECH MAN Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lake Placid, Florida Posts: 3,207 Likes: 1,049 Liked 235 Times in 110 Posts	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... I found a few that were like this in my early days with IHRA. After I explaned what tech looked for and how cams were checked we had very few problems later on. Its no big deal and just fix the minor problem and go on. The lite bottom ends and doctored up heads and intakes are a far greater problem for tech to deal with. Your fellow racers and tech wont "Hang" you for it.

05-02-2010, 08:04 AM	#14
Robert Swartz Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Nineveh, Indiana Posts: 512 Likes: 0 Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... Wade, Like the consensus says, fix the problem and move on. You're not the first to get bounced for tech. The guys I ran with in the 70's lost a class win at Indy due to a bad cam. My take, the key to something like this is what you learn from it. __________________ Robert Swartz - Swartz & Lane 66 Chevy II Pro 95 Achieva EF/SA, 78 Mustang II U/SA (work in progress) #354 stock

05-02-2010, 08:05 AM	#15
bob3240 Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: lebanon ohio Posts: 250 Likes: 3 Liked 14 Times in 4 Posts	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... I need to throw in my 2 cents worth on this. The dial indicator must be exactly parallel to the travel of the valve to read correctly. The least error in angle will cause the indicator to read a longer path than the valve travel. It's like the long side of a triangle. You can check this on a lathe or mill with a digital readout. set the indicator a little out of line and see the difference in readings you get. Hey, Wade , you're still going to have one of the baddest stockers in the land. Don't feel bad, carry on !! Bob Michael

05-02-2010, 08:43 AM	#16
Tom Moock Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 801 Likes: 1 Liked 10 Times in 6 Posts	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... Darrin, they use pumped up for length, Bob^3240 Wayne use`s a razor blade between the the spring and the retainer to place dial indicator on to check lift, last time mine was checked at Topeka. Tom __________________ Tom Moock 5704 STK

05-02-2010, 10:18 AM	#17
Jim Wahl Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Central Florida Posts: 5,842 Likes: 631 Liked 674 Times in 122 Posts	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... Had the same thing happen when I set the record at Bradenton many years ago. It was with the FWD Caddy. The cam in FWD is allowed to be .430 or more if it came stock with more lift. I checked .432 on the exhaust several times. Did .002 make a performance difference? Nah, but rules are rules. Bill Holt was the guy who did the checking and schooled me in lifter, push rod, and rocker differential and gave me all the slack he could. No good! I was bounced but I learned a lot that day. Put this behind you. It happens to all of us at one time or another who compete seriously. Jim __________________ Jim Wahl....NHRA #2239 S/SS - IHRA # 8 Stock, D2 Stock Champion (forever I guess) 2019 Baby Gators Stock Champion 2009 D2 National Open Stock Champion 1981 D2 West Palm Beach LDRS SS Runner Up Past President, Southern Stock / Super Stock Association.

05-02-2010, 12:11 PM	#18
art leong VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia Posts: 2,003 Likes: 0 Liked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... In overhead cam motors sinking the valves,grinding the tips, or putting new valves in changes the measured cam lift. __________________ Art Leong 2095 SS

05-02-2010, 10:05 PM	#19
Walker4108 Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Houston,TX Posts: 158 Likes: 43 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... Wade you are a true class act. Most guys would blame everybody under the sun. I know you and Alky Alex will get to work and you'll comeback scary fast. Walt __________________ Walt Walker

05-02-2010, 10:35 PM	#20
Travis Miller Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 476 Likes: 1 Liked 275 Times in 25 Posts	Re: My Teardown @ St Louis..... The following is printed in the 2010 NHRA rulebook under Stock - Camshaft. <"...Lift checked at valve retainer, with zero lash. Hydraulic lifter cam will be checked with pushrod and rocker as run, plus solid lifter, at zero lash. Plunger height of checking lifter will match extended height (no preload) of hydraulic lifter."> In teardown we match the total overall height of the checking lifter to the hydraulic lifter without preload. We even have a special tool for matching the total lifter/pushrod length. We also make sure the dial indicator is operating parallel with the valve stem by lining it up in all directions. Travis (Disclaimer: Opinions expressed by me on this forum are exactly that, my opinions.)