S and SS change - Page 2

Billy Nees · 12-30-2009, 04:29 PM

Dick, by the way, I won't vote on that poll.

Nitro Joe Jackson · 12-30-2009, 05:38 PM

you forgot a tab on the Vote, Dick "None of the Above"

Ed Fernandez · 12-30-2009, 05:55 PM

I think that pole is tilted to serve an agenda..To get rid of slower classes and cars.AND
to try and penalize the dreaded "Pro Sportsman" types.After all not many of them come to set records and win class.

Don Kennedy · 12-30-2009, 06:20 PM

The Poll has some kind of "Huge Spin " to it I won't vote on this poll LOL.

The present Stock and Super Stock rules and regulations are not broken , i repeat they are not broken The majority of Stock and Super Stock racers are Happy with the way it is now only the "very few" especially on this web site are unhappy for some reason or another, Just my Opinion of racing since 1963 Stock and Super stock

Dick Butler · 12-30-2009, 06:59 PM

I have to admit, there is an agenda to the poll.
1) create a better show for a crowd,
2) create a more radical HP adjustment mechanism to level the factoring where NHRA drags its feet for YEARS.
3) give some Point credit for the Fastest cars built by some people or tuned.
4) make it rewarding to win class with points so the Pro Sportsmen who come to win the event will be reminded that Beating another car of the same specs is part of Drag Racing also not just the Bracket Mentality of Eliminator.
5) make it worthwhile to be FAST and SHOW it towards points to be Champion of the year by setting records even at cost of HP.
6 ) possibly re attract sponsors or NHRA attention to Stk and SS using the NEW cars (currently underfactored) and the old cars(many currently maximally factored)

All I could think of at this time..... But Ed The changes do not angle at any slow cars or fast cars. Even if there were a massive combining of classes cars can be adapted to classes even if they had to put a 4 barrel on the motor or put the motor in a sedan instead of a 9 passenger wagon.
Dont take this as too serious. It is not to NHRA it is a discussion among racers and experienced previous racers..
Don Im Glad you are happy with the way it is today also...

Billy Nees · 12-30-2009, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dick Butler

I have to admit, there is an agenda to the poll.
1) create a better show for a crowd,
2) create a more radical HP adjustment mechanism to level the factoring where NHRA drags its feet for YEARS.
3) give some Point credit for the Fastest cars built by some people or tuned.
4) make it rewarding to win class with points so the Pro Sportsmen who come to win the event will be reminded that Beating another car of the same specs is part of Drag Racing also not just the Bracket Mentality of Eliminator.
5) make it worthwhile to be FAST and SHOW it towards points to be Champion of the year by setting records even at cost of HP.
6 ) possibly re attract sponsors or NHRA attention to Stk and SS using the NEW cars (currently underfactored) and the old cars(many currently maximally factored)

All I could think of at this time..... But Ed The changes do not angle at any slow cars or fast cars. Even if there were a massive combining of classes cars can be adapted to classes even if they had to put a 4 barrel on the motor or put the motor in a sedan instead of a 9 passenger wagon.
Dont take this as too serious. It is not to NHRA it is a discussion among racers and experienced previous racers..
Don Im Glad you are happy with the way it is today also...

Dick, ya know, it always seems that you and I are on opposite sides of the fence.
1.There is no better (car) show on the face of the earth then the staging lanes at a National Event before the first round of S/SS. Either the crowd wants to see our type of cars or they don't. If you want to put on a better show for the crowd then might I suggest hitting the guardrail at 1000' and going end over end because THAT is what the average spectator wants to see. And I'm sorry to have to say that but it's true.
2. How do you expect to come up with a more "radical HP adjustment mechanism" by waiveing the AHFS during class eliminations.
3. I have absolutely no problem with rewarding a person for outperforming his peers BUT he HAS to be proven legal and I don't see NHRA taking the necessary measures.
4. I think you will find that the "Pro Sportsmen" that you are referring to usually have enough ammo to do well in a "Heads Up" situation.
5. Again I have no problem with that BUT if this "fast" racer isn't torn down and he wins the World Championship (which has happened) illegally then we're worse off than we are now.
6. Until NHRA makes it worthwhile and attractive for potential sponsors to participate that's not going to happen.

Dick, I don't mean this with any malice but if you are going to try and improve S/SS racing then I feel that maybe you should participate more and I don't just mean going to NHRA Events.

Ed Fernandez · 12-30-2009, 08:22 PM

Taking a page from the Don Kennedy journalism school:
Dick said "combining of classes cars can be adapted to classes even if they had to put a 4 barrel on the motor or put the motor in a sedan instead of a 9 passenger wagon."
Ed said: I don't think that's in the spirit of the rules for STOCK elininator.

Don thanks for the loan of the writing style.
BTW,it seems that you've made a 180 degree turn in respect to the rules we're supposed to follow.
Don said: The present Stock and Super Stock rules and regulations are not broken , i repeat they are not broken.

Happy New Years
Y'all

Mark Yacavone · 12-30-2009, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by art leong

Dick you do know that points meets and national opens count towards the ahfs now right?
.

Artie, Where does it say that?

Dick Butler · 12-30-2009, 09:31 PM

Billy, I agree with you completely on all counts. Tear down for all records. Tear down for all class winners. AHFS is just Extended to Records also. Class runs all count also but the idea was to get a reason to set the records and win class by going fast enough to hit the HP more times per year till things flatten out.Points towards Championship should be earned MORE ways than just rounds of eliminator.

Ed, 4 barrel versus 2 barrel meant "within the rules" if the car is a 2 barrel only motor? use the next wt up or down. If not the chassis change or motor change....I bet this would be a real minor % of combos in this situation.

Nope: no 180s on rules. All rules the same unless condense classes. Then just more ways to win points if you get HP because you hit the AHFS.

1000 ft mark popularity is because they can see who gets there first. That holds for class heads up too.

Ed Fernandez · 12-30-2009, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dick Butler

Billy, I agree with you completely on all counts. Tear down for all records. Tear down for all class winners. AHFS is just Extended to Records also. Class runs all count also but the idea was to get a reason to set the records and win class by going fast enough to hit the HP more times per year till things flatten out.Points towards Championship should be earned MORE ways than just rounds of eliminator.

Ed, 4 barrel versus 2 barrel meant "within the rules" if the car is a 2 barrel only motor? use the next wt up or down. If not the chassis change or motor change....I bet this would be a real minor % of combos in this situation.

Nope: no 180s on rules. All rules the same unless condense classes. Then just more ways to win points if you get HP because you hit the AHFS.

1000 ft mark popularity is because they can see who gets there first. That holds for class heads up too.

Ed, 4 barrel versus 2 barrel meant "within the rules" if the car is a 2 barrel only motor?

How is that "within the rules"? Then I can put a 4 bbl from a 290CI V-8 on my six cylinder?
Then Billy can put a 4 bbl from a 327/350 on his six cylinder? Then a 350/255 Chevy can put on a 4 bbl from a 350?Who will calculate what HP factor to put on a 4 bbl conversion to a 2 bbl engine(different compression,cam specs,etc)?That's only for starters.Dick,I'm sure you have great knowledge of medical matters,but it doesn't translate over to problems we have now in
S/SS racing.The 180 degree comment was directed to Don K not you.

1000 ft mark popularity is because they can see who gets there first. That holds for class heads up too

Are you suggesting that S/SS run 1000' for class??????

View Poll Results: Changes to consider
Get big points for setting records, AHFS off records	23	67.65%
Big Points to win class/ round (CUT # of Classes)	2	5.88%
Cut # of classes to 16 each and Big Points for Class or Records	6	17.65%
Move to Lb /Hp Spec type motors no HP ratings	3	8.82%
Voters: 34. You may not vote on this poll

12-30-2009, 04:29 PM	#11
Billy Nees VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: On a hilltop in Pa. Posts: 4,485 Likes: 3,582 Liked 7,679 Times in 1,730 Posts	Re: S and SS change Dick, by the way, I won't vote on that poll. __________________ Billy Nees 1188 STK, SS I'm not spending 100K to win 2K

12-30-2009, 05:38 PM	#12
Nitro Joe Jackson VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Loudonville, Ohio or where ever the Nitro Lounge is parked Posts: 2,293 Likes: 57 Liked 67 Times in 19 Posts	Re: S and SS change you forgot a tab on the Vote, Dick "None of the Above" __________________ Nitro Joe Jackson STK 3431 nitrojoe@neo.rr.com

12-30-2009, 05:55 PM	#13
Ed Fernandez Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NOO JOISEY nexta NOO YAWK Posts: 5,879 Likes: 38 Liked 100 Times in 45 Posts	Re: S and SS change I think that pole is tilted to serve an agenda..To get rid of slower classes and cars.AND to try and penalize the dreaded "Pro Sportsman" types.After all not many of them come to set records and win class. __________________ Former NHRA #1945 Former IHRA #1945 T/SA

12-30-2009, 06:20 PM	#14
Don Kennedy VIP Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Near Portland TN Posts: 1,590 Likes: 3,876 Liked 902 Times in 237 Posts	Re: S and SS change The Poll has some kind of "Huge Spin " to it I won't vote on this poll LOL. The present Stock and Super Stock rules and regulations are not broken , i repeat they are not broken The majority of Stock and Super Stock racers are Happy with the way it is now only the "very few" especially on this web site are unhappy for some reason or another, Just my Opinion of racing since 1963 Stock and Super stock __________________ Don Kennedy 7701 SS

12-30-2009, 06:59 PM	#15
Dick Butler VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Richmond Indiana Posts: 1,196 Likes: 5 Liked 32 Times in 19 Posts	Re: S and SS change I have to admit, there is an agenda to the poll. 1) create a better show for a crowd, 2) create a more radical HP adjustment mechanism to level the factoring where NHRA drags its feet for YEARS. 3) give some Point credit for the Fastest cars built by some people or tuned. 4) make it rewarding to win class with points so the Pro Sportsmen who come to win the event will be reminded that Beating another car of the same specs is part of Drag Racing also not just the Bracket Mentality of Eliminator. 5) make it worthwhile to be FAST and SHOW it towards points to be Champion of the year by setting records even at cost of HP. 6 ) possibly re attract sponsors or NHRA attention to Stk and SS using the NEW cars (currently underfactored) and the old cars(many currently maximally factored) All I could think of at this time..... But Ed The changes do not angle at any slow cars or fast cars. Even if there were a massive combining of classes cars can be adapted to classes even if they had to put a 4 barrel on the motor or put the motor in a sedan instead of a 9 passenger wagon. Dont take this as too serious. It is not to NHRA it is a discussion among racers and experienced previous racers.. Don Im Glad you are happy with the way it is today also...

12-30-2009, 08:22 PM	#17
Ed Fernandez Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NOO JOISEY nexta NOO YAWK Posts: 5,879 Likes: 38 Liked 100 Times in 45 Posts	Re: S and SS change Taking a page from the Don Kennedy journalism school: Dick said "combining of classes cars can be adapted to classes even if they had to put a 4 barrel on the motor or put the motor in a sedan instead of a 9 passenger wagon." Ed said: I don't think that's in the spirit of the rules for STOCK elininator. Don thanks for the loan of the writing style. BTW,it seems that you've made a 180 degree turn in respect to the rules we're supposed to follow. Don said: The present Stock and Super Stock rules and regulations are not broken , i repeat they are not broken. Happy New Years Y'all __________________ Former NHRA #1945 Former IHRA #1945 T/SA

12-30-2009, 09:31 PM	#19
Dick Butler VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Richmond Indiana Posts: 1,196 Likes: 5 Liked 32 Times in 19 Posts	Re: S and SS change Billy, I agree with you completely on all counts. Tear down for all records. Tear down for all class winners. AHFS is just Extended to Records also. Class runs all count also but the idea was to get a reason to set the records and win class by going fast enough to hit the HP more times per year till things flatten out.Points towards Championship should be earned MORE ways than just rounds of eliminator. Ed, 4 barrel versus 2 barrel meant "within the rules" if the car is a 2 barrel only motor? use the next wt up or down. If not the chassis change or motor change....I bet this would be a real minor % of combos in this situation. Nope: no 180s on rules. All rules the same unless condense classes. Then just more ways to win points if you get HP because you hit the AHFS. 1000 ft mark popularity is because they can see who gets there first. That holds for class heads up too.