Manual Trans Help

[randy wilson]

all those tips are all true, but i know you can run a T-10 or nash and get buy if you run 1800 base with rag clutch and be fairly easy on parts, or help me out here guys, 300-400 on sintered iron and get by on the base with a long style pressure plate. stanley dye sells all sorts of used nash parts, just be careful.

[Scotty D]

i agree with randy in the fact that you can make a nash or a st-10 live.i think mark is referring to the lack of experience in causing stuff to not work out.butwith the right clutch setup both trans's can live and you can have a whole lot of fun racing in the stock/superstock organizations until you can afford to put the best bullet proof pieces in it to go to nhra races with and be compettive.kris rachford(69 cobra) and i both know the same person that can make a st-10 that would work very well in this format.

[Dwight Southerland]

Unless you already have a transmission to start with, you will be much, much better off to wait until you can save the money to buy a Jerico or G-Force. Yes, you can make a T-10 live, especially if you know how to work on them and work on your clutch. However, if you are starting from scratch, good used race transmissions are regularly available in the $2000-$2800 range if you shop around. You will spend at least half that much for a T-10 that will live. You have a combination that is heavy, low rpm (relatively), and lots of torque. OEM T-10 parts will not last. There are nickel gear sets available, but they are not cheap. Cast iron cases are available for the T-10, but they are not cheap.

Before the rules were opened up to allow aftermarket transmissions, my number one cause of lost races due to mechanical failure was transmission, and I was buying the best available stuff from G&G. One of the factors I considered when moving from Stock to Super Stock at the time was being able to use an aftermarket transmission. The Jerico made my racing fun again. My transmission maintenance cost in time and money was 1/10 of what it had been, even moving from A/S to SS/C.

Bottom line - even if you have to delay your racing by a year, you will more than make up for the lost time in enjoyment factor and money saved.

My humble opinion, worth approximately a nickel in today's economy, but still a bargain.

[mtwilly]

Hey, guys. This is a very infomative conversation. Keep it up! There definately seems to be more of a learning curve with a stick, but that's cool with me. This car will probably not see NHRA action for a few years, I just want to pick a plan and stick with it so i can get to where i want to be and i definately want to run a stick. It will just take me awhile to get to the high end stuff.

Hey Scott D, i would appreciate the info on your st-10 guy if you don't mind sharing .

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by tomslik

...then you'tr prolly not gonna like MY setup....
yes, i'll be using a st-10 w/ 3.44 1st,bunch lighter car,though

"Prolly" not. If you're setting your car to run up on the hill, I'm not qualified to comment.
In a non -altitude situation , I'd say that's way too much first gear for a light , V8 car.
It'll hurt more than it help ...Launch , clutch setup , and even mph , if you can believe that.
I ran a 3.97 first in my 2300 turbo Mustang ,but for an entirely different reason.

[Mike Taylor 3601]

Tom slik,
That trans is weakest T-10 made&ratios are terrible. 3.42/2.28/1.46/1-1.
1-2 is not bad 2-3 can you say bogggg?3-4 is not bad but still drops rpm pretty bad. Back when I first started racing still drove car on street broke my trans buddy had one of those 3.42 first T-10s traded him out of it I knew it was super t-10 but had no ideal what the ratios were,pulled out of garage knew 1st was lower.eased through gears made sure it worked
turn around launched it on way back 1st was quick went 2nd I thought hey this feels good went to third I thought it was going to kill engine. 2-3 has gear spread about like GM bulldog 4 spd has on 2-3 shift. Made about 6 passes in 12.70 street tire car not sticky street tires plain ol back in the day N-50s.
Soft clutches absolutely help but I would'nt run a stock style trans unless I have to which I do in my Pure Stocker.
I see ol Nash's sometimes 800.00 and up Liberty is selling there version of nash 5 spd. and all the parts are supposed to interchange with original nashes there have faceplate style sliders.
If you buy a 2 or 3 T-10s you have come close to a new Jerico.600.00 up is about going price for good used T-10,then if you pro shift it you spent about another 300.00 if you can tear apart & put back together yourself. I have'nt checked in last year or so but new Jerico
was about 2500.00 plus ship & shifter.
Mike Taylor 3601

[Scotty D]

mtwilly you have a pm.

[6point6]

Mr.Yacavone,
I remember very well, and still have the articles from High Performance Magazine of your Project Eliminator 77 Firebird. I have a 78 T/A that I always thought could be a stocker someday and i have to credit those series of articles from the 90's as motavation. Could you please expand on why you feel a manual trans in a low compression 400 second generation firebird is not a good mix. It sounds like its not really a parts breaking or clutch issue to you but something else. Those cars are heavy and the motor limited in RPM so is it you cant put enough gear
reduction into it to avoid the old spin or bog situation? Lets assume were using a bullet proof driveline and a good clutch.

[Mark Yacavone]

^^^^ That's basically it. It's just a hard combo to make leave consistently.
We ran .88's with the stick ,but I suppose, with the high dollar lifters and higher seat pressure , you could run it through okay with 5.13's . That might help with overall gear ratio lower. I don't see where a lightweight double or triple disc setup would work . It seems to need some flywheel weight to launch within the rpm range.
The automatic cars work very well with a 4.56 gear, so you see that all that extra gear required for a stick is not a good situation.
Bottom line ,as I said; Too much weight, not enough rpms for a stick.

Build a 67-8 car if you have to have a stick shift Pontiac.

Thanks for reading and remembering those articles.

Mark

[Chris "drooze" Wertman]

I am very curious about this thread, I have "considered" also running the DP as a stick car.

I likes gears.....and Im good at shifts....(better if I can do it with my foot but...)

I am seeing everyone say go aftermarket, pretty much across the board.

I have a new T56 Viper tranny that came with the DP car (ours didnt come with a "core" as many others did, but a current year new tranny)

So.....

The ratios are
2.66
1.78
1.30
1.00
0.74
0.50
2.90


I would obviously never get past 4th (gated plate to lock them out ?)

Is there anything "wrong" about running this trans ?

I know they can handle the power if built right, no problems.

What other things might be "run into" using this combo ?

The other ratios readily available are
2.97
2.07
1.43
1.00


Just thinking ....

I like the idea, but Im not shelling out 5k+ on our next auto PLUS a gearbox, IF I could use th viper tranny I would consider it, otherwise its going in my 72 Chally.....

Cheers

Chris

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

^^^^ That's basically it. It's just a hard combo to make leave consistently.
We ran .88's with the stick ,but I suppose, with the high dollar lifters and higher seat pressure , you could run it through okay with 5.13's . That might help with overall gear ratio lower. I don't see where a lightweight double or triple disc setup would work . It seems to need some flywheel weight to launch within the rpm range.
The automatic cars work very well with a 4.56 gear, so you see that all that extra gear required for a stick is not a good situation.
Bottom line ,as I said; Too much weight, not enough rpms for a stick.

Build a 67-8 car if you have to have a stick shift Pontiac.

Thanks for reading and remembering those articles.

Mark