Extict A car...

[Barry Polley]

Originally Posted by art leong

If we had your attitude at Indy in 1980. We would not have won the race or the W.R. Grace Cup
There were 5 cars in B/SA And we were the 4th slowest. There were only 14 qualifying spots. So according to you we should have just gone home. How dare NHRA allow those mid motored, fiberglass bodied Corvettes in our class. They should have been put in a sports car class. RIGHT?
Well with a lot of luck and some great driving we won the class, the eliminator, and the W.R. Grace Cup.
It is amazing that when you think there is nothing left in a combo, somebody that doesn't agree finds something.
Other than class, how many heads up runs do you have? An awful lot of races have been won by the slowest car in the class.

Art, with all due respect can you cover 5 tenths or more with an 0 lite? Were those cars you are refering to factory race cars? No! I have more race attitude than you could imagine. Never said I quit, never said I was done searching for more power. The point is in the next two years there is now way the fastest REAL Stock or Super Stockers in the country can compete in the same class. Yes with some luck and great driving you will do OK but now, no way. If we had the money and the time my partners and I would have been there getting our rears handed to us. I know I am not alone on the subject.


Barry

[art leong]

Originally Posted by Barry Polley

Art, with all due respect can you cover 5 tenths or more with an 0 lite? Were those cars you are refering to factory race cars? No! I have more race attitude than you could imagine. Never said I quit, never said I was done searching for more power. The point is in the next two years there is now way the fastest REAL Stock or Super Stockers in the country can compete in the same class. Yes with some luck and great driving you will do OK but now, no way. If we had the money and the time my partners and I would have been there getting our rears handed to us. I know I am not alone on the subject.


Barry

I agree that these cars aren't factored correctly. But this is their first year and they will be getting 3.25 percent Tuesday. There are quite a few of them not just one or two. The AHFS will catchup with them, like it did for the FI cars. I just hope these guys run their cars for real and not to the 1000'
I was around in the "dartboard " days and believe me you don't want that back. Cars were factored and defactored for things that had absolutely nothing to do with performance.
This whole internet thing has brought out the worst in people.
Remember a few years ago when they wanted to ban guys like Biondo, Fletcher, Richardson, Emmons. Etc. The so called Professional sportsman racers?
Then the end of the world was near due to fuel injection.
Then last year a brand new Cobra Jet went out and won the Pomona race..
We will see who wins Indy. But whoever it is it will be because of driving. and car knowledge, not a HP advantage.

[B Aceves]

Originally Posted by art leong

I agree that these cars aren't factored correctly. But this is their first year and they will be getting 3.25 percent Tuesday. There are quite a few of them not just one or two. The AHFS will catchup with them, like it did for the FI cars. I just hope these guys run their cars for real and not to the 1000'
I was around in the "dartboard " days and believe me you don't want that back. Cars were factored and defactored for things that had absolutely nothing to do with performance.
This whole internet thing has brought out the worst in people.
Remember a few years ago when they wanted to ban guys like Biondo, Fletcher, Richardson, Emmons. Etc. The so called Professional sportsman racers?
Then the end of the world was near due to fuel injection.
Then last year a brand new Cobra Jet went out and won the Pomona race..
We will see who wins Indy. But whoever it is it will be because of driving. and car knowledge, not a HP advantage.

Must coming from a guy who never has more than 2 cars in his class at a National
Last time I looked Heads up runs in the Elliminator do count. Guess you need no HP for that. LOL

[B Aceves]

Perfect Example Art, Last time I checked Brian is a Damn good Driver
This BS cost him a real good shot at winning
Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed-----Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed
4312 P.B. Candies 2523 Bryan Phillips
E3 ****WINNER**** 0.325 10.219 132.44 0.002 10.718 104.65
E/SA Dial: 11.70 (+/-): -1.481 E/SA Dial: 11.70 (+/-): -0.982
Prior rounds:
E2 (M Truman ) 0.092 10.248 0.018 (F Maiolo ) 0.037 10.854 0.024
E1 (R West ) 0.050 10.233 0.033 (W Lent ) 0.015 10.891 0.111
Qualified: #7 10.399 -1.301 #55 10.827 -0.873

Heads up race and Phillips nails the tree to no avail. Candies has a 0.325 light and still wins by 27 feet

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by art leong

I agree that these cars aren't factored correctly. But this is their first year and they will be getting 3.25 percent Tuesday. There are quite a few of them not just one or two. The AHFS will catchup with them, like it did for the FI cars. I just hope these guys run their cars for real and not to the 1000'
I was around in the "dartboard " days and believe me you don't want that back. Cars were factored and defactored for things that had absolutely nothing to do with performance.
This whole internet thing has brought out the worst in people.
Remember a few years ago when they wanted to ban guys like Biondo, Fletcher, Richardson, Emmons. Etc. The so called Professional sportsman racers?
Then the end of the world was near due to fuel injection.
Then last year a brand new Cobra Jet went out and won the Pomona race..
We will see who wins Indy. But whoever it is it will be because of driving. and car knowledge, not a HP advantage.

Art, this is their second year, 3.25% won't even come close to reigning in a car that can run 1.7 under the new indexes (AKA 2 seconds under last year's indexes) and they've added more cars. And at least Ford is making plans for the next two years. At this rate, no matter how well the AHFS works, or how often it is triggered, there'll always be another killer or three ready to hit the track with a bogus factor that'll take years to reign in.

Outside of guys who race every weekend, like Fletcher, Biondo, the Richardsons, Rampy, and Bertozzi, all guys I know well and respect, most average racers may only be in a position to win a national event maybe 5 times in their life, if they race for 10-20 years. So, when they draw one of those bogus cars heads up, especially in the later rounds when they might just be on track to one of those rare shots at a win, it is really huge, especially for them. It's not just that the bogus cars might win a race, it's that they can easily prevent someone else from getting anything close to a fair shot at it.

[art leong]

Originally Posted by B Aceves

Must coming from a guy who never has more than 2 cars in his class at a National
Last time I looked Heads up runs in the Elliminator do count. Guess you need no HP for that. LOL

You should read all my posts in 1980 at Indy when there were only 14 qualifiyer spots.
There were 5 cars in B/SA About average for that time. We were the 4th slowest. The hemi at the time was factored to 440 hp only 5 away from where it is now (everone says they are no longer competitive) Some cars had us covered by close to 3 tenths. We won the class, the eliminator, and the Grace cup.
I'll accept your uninformed apoligy.

[art leong]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

Art, this is their second year, 3.25% won't even come close to reigning in a car that can run 1.7 under the new indexes (AKA 2 seconds under last year's indexes) and they've added more cars. And at least Ford is making plans for the next two years. At this rate, no matter how well the AHFS works, or how often it is triggered, there'll always be another killer or three ready to hit the track with a bogus factor that'll take years to reign in.

Outside of guys who race every weekend, like Fletcher, Biondo, the Richardsons, Rampy, and Bertozzi, all guys I know well and respect, most average racers may only be in a position to win a national event maybe 5 times in their life, if they race for 10-20 years. So, when they draw one of those bogus cars heads up, especially in the later rounds when they might just be on track to one of those rare shots at a win, it is really huge, especially for them. It's not just that the bogus cars might win a race, it's that they can easily prevent someone else from getting anything close to a fair shot at it.

You are right about the second year I meant first year they had to show what they had.
How about running class at more places. This would force things along quicker

[Alan Roehrich]

I think they should have class eliminations at every event. It's one of the few ways they could increase the effectiveness of the AHFS as it stands.

It's the first year they've decided to really show some of their potential. I think the rumor mill had something to do with that, and then there's the fact that there are more of them than there were last year.

[art leong]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

I think they should have class eliminations at every event. It's one of the few ways they could increase the effectiveness of the AHFS as it stands.

It's the first year they've decided to really show some of their potential. I think the rumor mill had something to do with that, and then there's the fact that there are more of them than there were last year.

I agree this would be constuctive instead of destructive.
And properly altitude correct

[B Aceves]

Originally Posted by art leong

You should read all my posts in 1980 at Indy when there were only 14 qualifiyer spots.
There were 5 cars in B/SA About average for that time. We were the 4th slowest. The hemi at the time was factored to 440 hp only 5 away from where it is now (everone says they are no longer competitive) Some cars had us covered by close to 3 tenths. We won the class, the eliminator, and the Grace cup.
I'll accept your uninformed apoligy.

I will apologize if you took my post as a personal attack it wasnt... But that was over
30 years ago Art LOL things have changed a little since then dont you think? We
have a average of 5 cars in E/SA at a Div race now lol. How many cars were in E
at Indy this year ? I do understand anything can happen but nothing short of a blown motor in these cars would help.