Ray Allen versus Jack Werst '1970 SS/EA Showdown'

[BadBanana]

Originally Posted by Hemi Moose

Hey BadBanana, do you remember any more stories from the team that worked on Ray Allen's Chevelle SS that you mentioned in an earlier post, maybe talk about the camshaft profile they used or any other interesting points about them building the car, were you ever present at any dyno sessions, or did they ever talk about any extra weight added to the car anywhere, etc.

.

At the time I was working at GK was rejuvinating my friendship with Ralph Truppi after being re-introduced to Ralph by Bill Jenkins, after spending a few years on active duty in the US Navy. My acquaintance with Ralph Truppi and Tommy Kling began in 1964 when I was the driver of Ted Hartman's "Bad Banana" F/S ('57 9 pass. wagon/ 283 hp) record holder and they, with Ray Allen as driver, ran in the same class, with a 348" Chevy. The later built the "Terrible Tangerine" with the same combination 9 pass wagon/283hp).
My friendship with Ralph grew steadily over the years because of a mutual respect.; and I was deeply saddened a couple of years ago by his passing. He became a true "best friend".
As far as the Briggs Chevy is concerned, I believe they used a relatively mild cmashaft, by GK standards, that had been designed as a small block cam profile for 1.5 rockers. The 1.7 rockers on the Big Block, however, turned it into a very good combo. It was a 309/318 grind, can't remember the lobe center, but I think 110. I know the car was quite heavy but I don't believe they went through any deceptive measures to illegally **** weight around - that wasn't Ralph's or Tommy's style. At the time they were into cylinder wall finishes, ring combinations, etc. There was a time when they were into very smooth (polished) cylinders with chrome stainless .043 rings, moved higher on the piston, and low tension second and oil rings. At the time that was pretty innovative and it no doubt found its way into the Chevelle motor. They eventually went away from the smooth finish and more in to .043 dyke type top rings - still high on the piston. Hoffman Machine would fill in the original top ring groove, because back in those days they would use the TRW replacement pistons.

They felt that Chrysler really wanted a car in their class to dethrone the Chevelle; and the car that, I believe, was built particular for that purpose, was the Fink Brothers car.
I hope I have given you some info, but I will probably remember more later.
Dave Colbert
P.S. I am planning to try to reprint that GK catalog from 1972 because it has hundreds of pictures of cars from that era that were GK users (just about everyone back then) for every make and class except the top fuel cars. I think the folks on this site might be interested.

[Paul Ceasrine]

Dave 'Bad Banana',

The big thing back then,,,,was the Sunnen CK-10 Power-Stroke
Cylinder Hone,,,,,,,,,that unit could really get that fine finish,,,,and
proper cross-hatch,,,,,,
Every Top Machine Shop had to get one,,,,,,,,that was the #1 piece of machine shop engine rebuilding equipment for the performance shops during those times,,,,
That CK-10,,,,,,,a beautiful piece of machinery...

[Rich Biebel]

Originally Posted by Paul Ceasrine

Dave 'Bad Banana',

The big thing back then,,,,was the Sunnen CK-10 Power-Stroke
Cylinder Hone,,,,,,,,,that unit could really get that fine finish,,,,and
proper cross-hatch,,,,,,
Every Top Machine Shop had to get one,,,,,,,,that was the #1 piece of machine shop engine rebuilding equipment for the performance shops during those times,,,,
That CK-10,,,,,,,a beautiful piece of machinery...

Yes a CK-10 was state of the art back then but you forgot one very important part....

The man doing the honing......Honing is right up there with other very specialized skills......I honed many many sets of rods and worked my butt off to make them straight and round....

I worked in a shop that did a great deal of machine work for Ralph at T/K's

The owner was named Bill Crowley at Crows Head Shop here in northern NJ.....If he honed your block you could be assured it was right and Ralph often called up after an engine that had just been dyno'ed with a fresh hone made more power than ever before.....

By then the super smooth cylinder wall finishing idea was long gone.....

Bill was fanatical about blocks and had a little technique for the final finish that seemed to always work.....

He was also a super talented head machinist and long befoe there was a Serdi or similar type machine his VJ's were just about perfect....

He also was a very skilled head and manifold porter.....and did some intakes that were not topped for many years....
He went to Nascar country......along with many others in the engine business......

[temccrea]

Originally Posted by Paul Ceasrine

Attachments

SS/EA Showdown,,,,,,
1970 Indy Nationals,,,,,

MYTH, MYSTERY or MISCONCEPTION

Ray Allen, 1970 Chevelle Malibu Convertible SS454/450HP LS-6
Briggs Chevrolet,,,,,
"Truppi-Kling Competition"

versus

Jack Werst, 1970 Superbird, 426/425HP Street Hemi
Bash Engine
"Philadelphia Region Plymouth Dealers Association"

False claims,,,,,,,that they never raced each other....

Ray Allen won the SS/EA Class at the 1970 Indy Nationals...
But, was eliminated in Super/Stock Eliminator.

Glad I took this photo to document the run! This one sure has made the rounds since I first posted it and the shot of Landy's Charger which was owned by Eddie Thomas at the time.

[Bob Pagano]

John Hoffman never had a Ck-10, he used a big ice tub and honed by hand and his stuff was fast.

[Paul Precht]

Originally Posted by Rich Biebel

Yes a CK-10 was state of the art back then but you forgot one very important part....

The man doing the honing......Honing is right up there with other very specialized skills......I honed many many sets of rods and worked my butt off to make them straight and round....

I worked in a shop that did a great deal of machine work for Ralph at T/K's

The owner was named Bill Crowley at Crows Head Shop here in northern NJ.....If he honed your block you could be assured it was right and Ralph often called up after an engine that had just been dyno'ed with a fresh hone made more power than ever before.....

By then the super smooth cylinder wall finishing idea was long gone.....

Bill was fanatical about blocks and had a little technique for the final finish that seemed to always work.....

He was also a super talented head machinist and long befoe there was a Serdi or similar type machine his VJ's were just about perfect....

He also was a very skilled head and manifold porter.....and did some intakes that were not topped for many years....
He went to Nascar country......along with many others in the engine business......

The man doing the honing was everything with the old Sunnen rod machines, it's an art all by itself, my hands still hurt just thinking about it.
When I worked with Ritchie Zul in the mid 70s he was still using the mirror finish cylinder walls on the Pro Stock motors he built for a few customers, I did all the block prep and boring but Nassau Hone did the honing.. My ears are still ringing from the dyno pulls.

[BadBanana]

Originally Posted by Rich Biebel

Yes a CK-10 was state of the art back then but you forgot one very important part....

The man doing the honing......Honing is right up there with other very specialized skills......I honed many many sets of rods and worked my butt off to make them straight and round....

I worked in a shop that did a great deal of machine work for Ralph at T/K's

The owner was named Bill Crowley at Crows Head Shop here in northern NJ.....If he honed your block you could be assured it was right and Ralph often called up after an engine that had just been dyno'ed with a fresh hone made more power than ever before.....

By then the super smooth cylinder wall finishing idea was long gone.....

Bill was fanatical about blocks and had a little technique for the final finish that seemed to always work.....

He was also a super talented head machinist and long befoe there was a Serdi or similar type machine his VJ's were just about perfect....

He also was a very skilled head and manifold porter.....and did some intakes that were not topped for many years....
He went to Nascar country......along with many others in the engine business......

I remember Crow's Head Shop and Bill very well. He did my blocks for my SS/EA '69 Camaro; also some head work under the valve and intake manifold work. His shop was special. The thing about Truppi Kling is that they didn't do any machine work, but rather sent each part to the people he found could do the very best work on a particular part; and then told them exactly what HE wanted. Later when the head rule opened up he used Brandwine head Service a lot.
I used to let Ralph send my blocks, heads and manifold to Crow's; Got my crank work done at RC Automotivr in Alex., VA and then go up to T-K to assemble, dyno and tune the motor there before taking it home. In those days we only had stock blocks so we had them all checked for wall thickness, especially on the thrust side of the bore (at least .100) and hardness checked. Good (thick) but soft blocks may have gotten the chrome stainless rings and hard blocks the moly rings. I had a time convincing Ralph that I wanted to use cast cranks. Of course we needed to have them "magged " to find a good one; but they were lighter and while they made no more power on the dyno at a given rpm, I always felt the motor was able to accelerate through the rpms faster.- and hit the converter harder.

[KMachine]

Originally Posted by BadBanana

Got my crank work done at RC Automotivr in Alex., VA .

Thats a name I haven't heard about in awhile. I spent a week at Roy's shop in 1990. Roy brought a seri 100 and I had to set it up and get it working.

LOL, Roy sure like to drink and talk.

[KMachine]

Originally Posted by Paul Ceasrine

Dave 'Bad Banana',

The big thing back then,,,,was the Sunnen CK-10 Power-Stroke
Cylinder Hone,,,,,,,,,that unit could really get that fine finish,,,,and
proper cross-hatch,,,,,,
Every Top Machine Shop had to get one,,,,,,,,that was the #1 piece of machine shop engine rebuilding equipment for the performance shops during those times,,,,
That CK-10,,,,,,,a beautiful piece of machinery...

Jenkins, never had a CK-10.
Tryson would finish the blocks in a home made "honing tank"

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by KMachine

Jenkins, never had a CK-10.
Tryson would finish the blocks in a home made "honing tank"

Tryson used a Sunnen HAND hone. I have the same model and have used it a lot. You can controll the cross hatch pattern and speed better with one.