Body roll part 2....see!!! - Page 2

ericsz · 04-15-2010, 08:25 AM

the car did only have a 4 point cage in it, I have this week welded in the door bars, the car does have frame connectors on it and I are in the process of beefing them up as well. Keep in mind the car was minit tubbed and the leafs were moved in about 5 inches on each side and the shocks were moved in about 3 inches on each side. I just want it to go straight again.

ericsz · 04-23-2010, 11:40 PM

Ok so I took it back to the track this past weekend and as I stated I welded the door bars in and also welded the sub frame connectors solid, I also tightened the front shock adjustment and it helped quite a bit but still twists, I was wondering before I put the anti roll bar in it what you guys would think about adding another shock to the back of the car on one side. if you notice in the pictures I have 2 different mounting locations for shocks on each side, my question is if I do try this which side should I put it on. I guess I have thought about it so much I have confused myself, would I put it on the drivers side rear to try to slow down the body seperation on the drivers side or would I want to put it on the passenger side to help control the compression on that side? Some folks watched it and said its like it does nothing on the passenger side rear and its all in the drivers side rear. I have thought about it both ways and I guess it makes sense both ways, just wanting your advise as I will be trying it out one way or the other this weekend. Thanks in advance...Oh just to clarify I am saying i will be running a total of 3 rear shocks 2 on one side and one on the other

SmallBlockNova · 04-25-2010, 11:54 AM

No. Have you pulled your rear shocks in and checked the valving? My car used to twist with QA1 single adjustables...Turns out 1 was bad. I now have AFCO double adjustables and the twist is gone.

ericsz · 05-04-2010, 02:04 PM

Here is an update, I am going to break down and buy an anti roll bar, shocks have all been tested and are fine, leafs were inspected and all fine, I did run an extra shock on the back of the car made 2 passes with the shock on each side, it helped quite a bit when it was on the drivers side, and almost felt worse when it was on the passenger side. I have made huge improvements to it compared to the first week out as now it is only bringing the front left tire up about 12-14 inches and the right front is at about 6 inches, I didn that by adding door bars to the cage, welding the bolt in connectors, tightening up the front shocks to full stiff (koni spa1) and installing rear aluminum leaf spring bushings. Not sure which one made the biggest difference but the car is at least driveable and raceable now as it 60'd 1.45's all night within .006. Just want it to feel better when it leaves if you know what i mean. I will be ordering the DM Products anti roll bar this week and installing it as soon as I get it.

Robert Simpson · 05-04-2010, 02:23 PM

Eric, to say the least you are making good progress. I am glad that it is coming around. I am sure the sway bar will take out the rest of the roll. One question does the car "dart" or pull to the right what you take off? I don't mean a sudden move to the wall or tree but I mean a noticeable move to the right when you take off. You are leaving off a brake right? No footbrake? Thanks again for the update.

Robert

Lapeeracing · 05-04-2010, 02:28 PM

I have been following this thread with some interest. I find it hard to imagine that a sbc would create such a problem.
I think that if you go back to before anything was changed on the car-was there a problem with body roll? If the answer is no then-what has changed? You relocated the leaf springs and rear shocks and reused the existing parts. Now we have a problem-yes? Two shocks are not going to fix it-I doubt that a anti-roll will totally cure it! So,I think we are back to shocks and springs- maybe not in that order- I don't know how you checked those-but I think that is where the problem lies. I would suggest that you talk to the spring mfg and see what they think. I am of the opinion that replacing springs and shocks will take care of your problem. I have done the same on a bbc camaro and did not have that problem.Just my 2 cents-hope that helped with troubleshooting your car-good luck!

ericsz · 05-05-2010, 11:56 AM

Here is a picture of how it left before. Straight as can be.

Mike Pearson · 05-05-2010, 04:06 PM

the problem most likely is not shocks. One time I got to the track and found I had a broken shock mount. I just took both shocks off of the back of the car. The car ran just as good with out the shocks as with. I had monoleafs and ladder bars at the time. Car ran high tens at the time with 10.5 tire. I would check for a twisted axle tube on the rear. There is definately something wrong with the car. I have not had to use a sway bar on my camaro.

Dean Feiock · 04-25-2010, 11:19 PM

Eric, think of it this way. When you are under throttle, the rear axle is acting like a big propeller. Instead of the drive shaft and pinion gear turning, the ring gear and housing are trying to walk around the pinion.

So rather than the car rolling over, the axle is actually trying to turn. When the axle is trying to turn, it is trying to push the left tire into the track and trying to lift the right tire off the ground. You see this as body roll, extension on the left and compresson on the right.

The springs and shocks normally control how much and how fast the axle can move. But when you move the springs and shocks closer to the center of the axle, their effects become less because their leverage is less. A stiffer spring, air bag, and tighter shock compression setting on the right side will slow down the compression. But your only option for the left is to tighten the shock extension.

A roll bar is your best bet at this point.

Bill Grubbs · 04-26-2010, 07:23 AM

It is intirely possible that one or both of your front shocks are toast. Try to borrow a pair of shocks for a buddy and see how they work.

04-15-2010, 08:25 AM	#1
ericsz Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 140 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! the car did only have a 4 point cage in it, I have this week welded in the door bars, the car does have frame connectors on it and I are in the process of beefing them up as well. Keep in mind the car was minit tubbed and the leafs were moved in about 5 inches on each side and the shocks were moved in about 3 inches on each side. I just want it to go straight again. __________________ Eric Bowling

04-23-2010, 11:40 PM	#2
ericsz Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 140 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! Ok so I took it back to the track this past weekend and as I stated I welded the door bars in and also welded the sub frame connectors solid, I also tightened the front shock adjustment and it helped quite a bit but still twists, I was wondering before I put the anti roll bar in it what you guys would think about adding another shock to the back of the car on one side. if you notice in the pictures I have 2 different mounting locations for shocks on each side, my question is if I do try this which side should I put it on. I guess I have thought about it so much I have confused myself, would I put it on the drivers side rear to try to slow down the body seperation on the drivers side or would I want to put it on the passenger side to help control the compression on that side? Some folks watched it and said its like it does nothing on the passenger side rear and its all in the drivers side rear. I have thought about it both ways and I guess it makes sense both ways, just wanting your advise as I will be trying it out one way or the other this weekend. Thanks in advance...Oh just to clarify I am saying i will be running a total of 3 rear shocks 2 on one side and one on the other __________________ Eric Bowling Last edited by ericsz; 04-24-2010 at 10:01 PM. Reason: Clarification

04-25-2010, 11:54 AM	#3
SmallBlockNova Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Long Island Posts: 47 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! No. Have you pulled your rear shocks in and checked the valving? My car used to twist with QA1 single adjustables...Turns out 1 was bad. I now have AFCO double adjustables and the twist is gone.

05-04-2010, 02:04 PM	#4
ericsz Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 140 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! Here is an update, I am going to break down and buy an anti roll bar, shocks have all been tested and are fine, leafs were inspected and all fine, I did run an extra shock on the back of the car made 2 passes with the shock on each side, it helped quite a bit when it was on the drivers side, and almost felt worse when it was on the passenger side. I have made huge improvements to it compared to the first week out as now it is only bringing the front left tire up about 12-14 inches and the right front is at about 6 inches, I didn that by adding door bars to the cage, welding the bolt in connectors, tightening up the front shocks to full stiff (koni spa1) and installing rear aluminum leaf spring bushings. Not sure which one made the biggest difference but the car is at least driveable and raceable now as it 60'd 1.45's all night within .006. Just want it to feel better when it leaves if you know what i mean. I will be ordering the DM Products anti roll bar this week and installing it as soon as I get it. __________________ Eric Bowling

05-04-2010, 02:23 PM	#5
Robert Simpson Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Jacksonville, Florida Posts: 808 Likes: 7 Liked 20 Times in 12 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! Eric, to say the least you are making good progress. I am glad that it is coming around. I am sure the sway bar will take out the rest of the roll. One question does the car "dart" or pull to the right what you take off? I don't mean a sudden move to the wall or tree but I mean a noticeable move to the right when you take off. You are leaving off a brake right? No footbrake? Thanks again for the update. Robert

05-04-2010, 02:28 PM	#6
Lapeeracing Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Michigan Posts: 17 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! I have been following this thread with some interest. I find it hard to imagine that a sbc would create such a problem. I think that if you go back to before anything was changed on the car-was there a problem with body roll? If the answer is no then-what has changed? You relocated the leaf springs and rear shocks and reused the existing parts. Now we have a problem-yes? Two shocks are not going to fix it-I doubt that a anti-roll will totally cure it! So,I think we are back to shocks and springs- maybe not in that order- I don't know how you checked those-but I think that is where the problem lies. I would suggest that you talk to the spring mfg and see what they think. I am of the opinion that replacing springs and shocks will take care of your problem. I have done the same on a bbc camaro and did not have that problem.Just my 2 cents-hope that helped with troubleshooting your car-good luck!

05-05-2010, 11:56 AM	#7
ericsz Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 140 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! Here is a picture of how it left before. Straight as can be. __________________ Eric Bowling

05-05-2010, 04:06 PM	#8
Mike Pearson VIP Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 2,476 Likes: 633 Liked 2,002 Times in 602 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! the problem most likely is not shocks. One time I got to the track and found I had a broken shock mount. I just took both shocks off of the back of the car. The car ran just as good with out the shocks as with. I had monoleafs and ladder bars at the time. Car ran high tens at the time with 10.5 tire. I would check for a twisted axle tube on the rear. There is definately something wrong with the car. I have not had to use a sway bar on my camaro. __________________ Mike Pearson 2485 SS

04-25-2010, 11:19 PM	#9
Dean Feiock Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Pierre, SD Posts: 204 Likes: 0 Liked 49 Times in 15 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! Eric, think of it this way. When you are under throttle, the rear axle is acting like a big propeller. Instead of the drive shaft and pinion gear turning, the ring gear and housing are trying to walk around the pinion. So rather than the car rolling over, the axle is actually trying to turn. When the axle is trying to turn, it is trying to push the left tire into the track and trying to lift the right tire off the ground. You see this as body roll, extension on the left and compresson on the right. The springs and shocks normally control how much and how fast the axle can move. But when you move the springs and shocks closer to the center of the axle, their effects become less because their leverage is less. A stiffer spring, air bag, and tighter shock compression setting on the right side will slow down the compression. But your only option for the left is to tighten the shock extension. A roll bar is your best bet at this point. __________________ Dean Feiock -- Stock 5002 Last edited by Dean Feiock; 04-25-2010 at 11:30 PM.

04-26-2010, 07:23 AM	#10
Bill Grubbs Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Magnolia, Texas Posts: 417 Likes: 3 Liked 573 Times in 67 Posts	Re: Body roll part 2....see!!! It is intirely possible that one or both of your front shocks are toast. Try to borrow a pair of shocks for a buddy and see how they work.