OLD Modified Corvettes - Page 19

Todd Bailey · 12-12-2013, 02:11 PM

Randy,

I agree with your comment on the spec head. That would be one complaint that the sanctioning body would complain about in that "We don't have enough tech guys as it is". Without a doubt, a spec head could limit the expense of extensively modified heads. From a spectator standpoint, they want to see the wheelstands and hear the sound of high RPM's. For many racers, this would be a chance to return to what type of racing they miss. I do not have the stats on racer participation but I believe it would slightly increase with the introduction of a Modified class. As Dick stated, keep it simple in what is allowed and it will help with the cost. Still expensive to do but people could afford to do it. This thread has had my attention since it started. D2 has index racing so why can't it be added to other divisions as well? Growing up, D4 was a pretty serious hotbed for Modified/Gas. I think if the powers-to-be see the excitement that it brings in spectators and racers, maybe it would put a bug in their ear. I would not have the first idea, though, of how to approach getting someone to listen to me on this topic.

randy wilson · 12-12-2013, 02:51 PM

If, and when the time comes, I have, what I think are good ideas. For starters on tech. Any car that wins, runner ups, or sets a national record, must, at that time, remove a head at their expense, and deliver it to the sanctioning body, to be shipped off to say, Brodix for final say. You, if you plan on being competitive, would carry a spare head. The one you send off could be bare. Another idea. Anyone could exchange bare heads, for
$1,000 plus exchange from any competitor. Just ideas. And also, no one has the answer on how, or who to approach. I do think it needs a full year to get up and running. I would pledge to attend enough races to claim points for a title. Not saying I think I would win it, just letting all know I would participate as much as possible. There is a LOT of talent out there that would come out of the woodwork. Mike Edwards ring a bell? Ha!

Todd Bailey · 12-12-2013, 03:32 PM

I guess the one thing is, will this idea die off or will someone take it until completion? Lots of work left to be done. Has there EVER been a definitive, clear-cut answer on why NHRA did away with Modified after the '81 season? Ed Wright, where are you??

randy wilson · 12-12-2013, 04:11 PM

I'm guessing tech is why it ended. Hope not, but my gut feeling. My rule ides will never call for a head, or oil pan to be pulled. A scope can do the heads until crisis inspection, and a scope can do the clutch in the bellhousing. Spec fuel, say C12. Spec tire, say 12.5 or 13.5. One 750 carb. Stock appearing. A scope in a window in the oil pan if, I say if you want to keep out trick cranks. Just some ideas.

Todd Bailey · 12-12-2013, 04:49 PM

Sounds pretty close to the original Super Modified until they opened the door on everything. What were you thinking for max cubic inches? Four speed or 5 speed as well?

randy wilson · 12-12-2013, 04:55 PM

Also, I'll furnish the P&G gauge, and the fuel check tool, and we could use portable scales at all events. Weigh after each round, fuel check final 4, and P&G the finalists.I have an oil sniffer somewhere I gave $1,900 for, I'll try to find, but we could select a committee to police ourselves. If I can't find it, we could take an oil sample to a lab, and have it diagnosed if we think someone is adding something to the oil, to bleed past the rings, or ingesting it into the engine someway. Real hard to cheat with the actual head company making the final decision. After all, they produce the head. I know comp guys are pretty intuitive, but I think we can keep one step ahead of them . Make the rules black, and white. No grey areas.

Dick Butler · 12-12-2013, 05:05 PM

Heading to PRI in the AM. I will follow up..Randy please give your basic engine plan so I can read over it and possibly use in in discussions. Thanks.
Interest appears to be building up so begin to encourage the discussions with fellow racers who may be sitting out at this time. Maybe one or two would enjoy getting involved in the project.

randy wilson · 12-12-2013, 06:54 PM

OK, Todd, I like 5 speeds because the more gears you hit, the better fans love it. But, only on the condition you Truly have to clutch, and shift ALL gears in a truly conventional way. I have ideas on how to make that happen, or make clutchless guys add 150 lbs. That will cure them. Now Dick. Here's what I've always had in the back of my mind as far as simple, affordable, interesting, and challenging. Also, very exciting, and. Here goes. Min. wt, 3,000 lbs. min. cube, 280, max cube 360. 9, 10, 11, lbs. per c.i.d. .01 per half lb. in the 1\8. .15 per half lb. in the 1\4. Brodix spec heads, Mopar, Ford, and Chevy. ONLY mods allowed are angle, or straight milling, valve job, and polishing the combustion chamber. Any valve, or limit them to steel. Just trying to save tear down problems, so bear with me. ANY cast intake, no external mods, readily available, any max. 2 " spacer, 1 750, 11 lb. 1 850 10 lb. 1 950 9 lb. No dry sumps, external pumps, no vac pump, no billet pumps, no belt drive, (negotiable on some of these, just trying to keep the cost down) Distributor in stock location only, No titanium or carbon fiber driveline parts, other then drive shaft for safety, and less breakage. Stud mounted rockers only, other then Miopar, (Think how the cam Co. would go for that) No RPM chips, must just drive. Spec box, let's say 7A. Spec 12.5, or 13.5 slicks. Cam must be stock journal diameter. Lifters also. Cranks not limited to stroke, but can not visibly be the ultimate. We'll discuss that later when I can actually explain it. Remember, tech MUST be simple. No left hand starters. 10" min diameter single disc clutch. No counter wts. No computers. No wheelie wheels. If my mind engages again, I'll let you know of other ideas. Ha! Let me know, but you get the drift.

randy wilson · 12-12-2013, 07:09 PM

Also, .4 pro tree only. That's about the only thing I'd throw a baby fit about. Trust me, it is WAY better in the long run. Been there, and done that. And I ain't even that good on one anymore, but the guys who are, should be rewarded. Believe it or not, I already have 3 small sponsors already lined up for me personally, and I've never had a sponsor in my life.

joespanova · 12-13-2013, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randy wilson

OK, Todd, I like 5 speeds because the more gears you hit, the better fans love it. But, only on the condition you Truly have to clutch, and shift ALL gears in a truly conventional way. I have ideas on how to make that happen, or make clutchless guys add 150 lbs. That will cure them. Now Dick. Here's what I've always had in the back of my mind as far as simple, affordable, interesting, and challenging. Also, very exciting, and. Here goes. Min. wt, 3,000 lbs. min. cube, 280, max cube 360. 9, 10, 11, lbs. per c.i.d. .01 per half lb. in the 1\8. .15 per half lb. in the 1\4. Brodix spec heads, Mopar, Ford, and Chevy. ONLY mods allowed are angle, or straight milling, valve job, and polishing the combustion chamber. Any valve, or limit them to steel. Just trying to save tear down problems, so bear with me. ANY cast intake, no external mods, readily available, any max. 2 " spacer, 1 750, 11 lb. 1 850 10 lb. 1 950 9 lb. No dry sumps, external pumps, no vac pump, no billet pumps, no belt drive, (negotiable on some of these, just trying to keep the cost down) Distributor in stock location only, No titanium or carbon fiber driveline parts, other then drive shaft for safety, and less breakage. Stud mounted rockers only, other then Miopar, (Think how the cam Co. would go for that) No RPM chips, must just drive. Spec box, let's say 7A. Spec 12.5, or 13.5 slicks. Cam must be stock journal diameter. Lifters also. Cranks not limited to stroke, but can not visibly be the ultimate. We'll discuss that later when I can actually explain it. Remember, tech MUST be simple. No left hand starters. 10" min diameter single disc clutch. No counter wts. No computers. No wheelie wheels. If my mind engages again, I'll let you know of other ideas. Ha! Let me know, but you get the drift.

I've been around for a long time as a fan and racer..........
Sorry , but this just isn't very appealing........too heavy and too many restrictions. Counter weight? So what.......who cares if I'm ( or anyones ) running counter weights? Same with a vac pump? I f the budget is so tight you can't afford a vac pump then you should be bracket racing or NOT racing at all.
" 1 750, 11 lb. 1 850 10 lb. 1 950 9 lb. " I have no idea what this means

No wheelie bars?
The cars with these rules would struggle to run mid nines........if nines at all.

12-12-2013, 02:11 PM	#181
Todd Bailey Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Houston Posts: 311 Likes: 29 Liked 31 Times in 16 Posts	Re: OLD Modified Corvettes Randy, I agree with your comment on the spec head. That would be one complaint that the sanctioning body would complain about in that "We don't have enough tech guys as it is". Without a doubt, a spec head could limit the expense of extensively modified heads. From a spectator standpoint, they want to see the wheelstands and hear the sound of high RPM's. For many racers, this would be a chance to return to what type of racing they miss. I do not have the stats on racer participation but I believe it would slightly increase with the introduction of a Modified class. As Dick stated, keep it simple in what is allowed and it will help with the cost. Still expensive to do but people could afford to do it. This thread has had my attention since it started. D2 has index racing so why can't it be added to other divisions as well? Growing up, D4 was a pretty serious hotbed for Modified/Gas. I think if the powers-to-be see the excitement that it brings in spectators and racers, maybe it would put a bug in their ear. I would not have the first idea, though, of how to approach getting someone to listen to me on this topic.

12-12-2013, 02:51 PM	#182
randy wilson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 882 Likes: 0 Liked 22 Times in 22 Posts	Re: OLD Modified Corvettes If, and when the time comes, I have, what I think are good ideas. For starters on tech. Any car that wins, runner ups, or sets a national record, must, at that time, remove a head at their expense, and deliver it to the sanctioning body, to be shipped off to say, Brodix for final say. You, if you plan on being competitive, would carry a spare head. The one you send off could be bare. Another idea. Anyone could exchange bare heads, for $1,000 plus exchange from any competitor. Just ideas. And also, no one has the answer on how, or who to approach. I do think it needs a full year to get up and running. I would pledge to attend enough races to claim points for a title. Not saying I think I would win it, just letting all know I would participate as much as possible. There is a LOT of talent out there that would come out of the woodwork. Mike Edwards ring a bell? Ha! __________________ don,t have one

12-12-2013, 03:32 PM	#183
Todd Bailey Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Houston Posts: 311 Likes: 29 Liked 31 Times in 16 Posts	Re: OLD Modified Corvettes I guess the one thing is, will this idea die off or will someone take it until completion? Lots of work left to be done. Has there EVER been a definitive, clear-cut answer on why NHRA did away with Modified after the '81 season? Ed Wright, where are you??

12-12-2013, 04:11 PM	#184
randy wilson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 882 Likes: 0 Liked 22 Times in 22 Posts	Re: OLD Modified Corvettes I'm guessing tech is why it ended. Hope not, but my gut feeling. My rule ides will never call for a head, or oil pan to be pulled. A scope can do the heads until crisis inspection, and a scope can do the clutch in the bellhousing. Spec fuel, say C12. Spec tire, say 12.5 or 13.5. One 750 carb. Stock appearing. A scope in a window in the oil pan if, I say if you want to keep out trick cranks. Just some ideas. __________________ don,t have one

12-12-2013, 04:49 PM	#185
Todd Bailey Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Houston Posts: 311 Likes: 29 Liked 31 Times in 16 Posts	Re: OLD Modified Corvettes Sounds pretty close to the original Super Modified until they opened the door on everything. What were you thinking for max cubic inches? Four speed or 5 speed as well?

12-12-2013, 04:55 PM	#186
randy wilson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 882 Likes: 0 Liked 22 Times in 22 Posts	Re: OLD Modified Corvettes Also, I'll furnish the P&G gauge, and the fuel check tool, and we could use portable scales at all events. Weigh after each round, fuel check final 4, and P&G the finalists.I have an oil sniffer somewhere I gave $1,900 for, I'll try to find, but we could select a committee to police ourselves. If I can't find it, we could take an oil sample to a lab, and have it diagnosed if we think someone is adding something to the oil, to bleed past the rings, or ingesting it into the engine someway. Real hard to cheat with the actual head company making the final decision. After all, they produce the head. I know comp guys are pretty intuitive, but I think we can keep one step ahead of them . Make the rules black, and white. No grey areas. __________________ don,t have one

12-12-2013, 05:05 PM	#187
Dick Butler VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Richmond Indiana Posts: 1,196 Likes: 5 Liked 32 Times in 19 Posts	Re: OLD Modified Corvettes Heading to PRI in the AM. I will follow up..Randy please give your basic engine plan so I can read over it and possibly use in in discussions. Thanks. Interest appears to be building up so begin to encourage the discussions with fellow racers who may be sitting out at this time. Maybe one or two would enjoy getting involved in the project.

12-12-2013, 06:54 PM	#188
randy wilson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 882 Likes: 0 Liked 22 Times in 22 Posts	Re: OLD Modified Corvettes OK, Todd, I like 5 speeds because the more gears you hit, the better fans love it. But, only on the condition you Truly have to clutch, and shift ALL gears in a truly conventional way. I have ideas on how to make that happen, or make clutchless guys add 150 lbs. That will cure them. Now Dick. Here's what I've always had in the back of my mind as far as simple, affordable, interesting, and challenging. Also, very exciting, and. Here goes. Min. wt, 3,000 lbs. min. cube, 280, max cube 360. 9, 10, 11, lbs. per c.i.d. .01 per half lb. in the 1\8. .15 per half lb. in the 1\4. Brodix spec heads, Mopar, Ford, and Chevy. ONLY mods allowed are angle, or straight milling, valve job, and polishing the combustion chamber. Any valve, or limit them to steel. Just trying to save tear down problems, so bear with me. ANY cast intake, no external mods, readily available, any max. 2 " spacer, 1 750, 11 lb. 1 850 10 lb. 1 950 9 lb. No dry sumps, external pumps, no vac pump, no billet pumps, no belt drive, (negotiable on some of these, just trying to keep the cost down) Distributor in stock location only, No titanium or carbon fiber driveline parts, other then drive shaft for safety, and less breakage. Stud mounted rockers only, other then Miopar, (Think how the cam Co. would go for that) No RPM chips, must just drive. Spec box, let's say 7A. Spec 12.5, or 13.5 slicks. Cam must be stock journal diameter. Lifters also. Cranks not limited to stroke, but can not visibly be the ultimate. We'll discuss that later when I can actually explain it. Remember, tech MUST be simple. No left hand starters. 10" min diameter single disc clutch. No counter wts. No computers. No wheelie wheels. If my mind engages again, I'll let you know of other ideas. Ha! Let me know, but you get the drift. __________________ don,t have one Last edited by randy wilson; 12-12-2013 at 06:58 PM.

12-12-2013, 07:09 PM	#189
randy wilson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 882 Likes: 0 Liked 22 Times in 22 Posts	Re: OLD Modified Corvettes Also, .4 pro tree only. That's about the only thing I'd throw a baby fit about. Trust me, it is WAY better in the long run. Been there, and done that. And I ain't even that good on one anymore, but the guys who are, should be rewarded. Believe it or not, I already have 3 small sponsors already lined up for me personally, and I've never had a sponsor in my life. __________________ don,t have one Last edited by randy wilson; 12-12-2013 at 07:20 PM.