Contingency Ideas for New IHRA owners

[Kegracing]

OK, get ready to flame away... Just want to throw some ideas out there and see what people say. MAYBE we can help in some way.

I am guessing some of the new IHRA owners and their contacts are reading these boards, to see how people are reacting. Would love to hear from some of you, if this is true!

First, I would like to see the new owners of IHRA really get back behind the sportsman racers, and get the car counts back to where they were 10 years ago. I know the economy and a lot of other things impact this, but it is just not the same "family deal" it was several years back. NOT saying IHRA is bad now... I still support them, and still say they are the more friendly sportsman body! But, I think a lot of old time IHRA racers would agree with me...?

So, for the Contingency stickers: Would the average racer be happier to get a smaller payout for a win and RU if they were not held to such a tight rule on: recent purchases, having receipts, having to renew with company every year, etc. AND there was a lot more companies posting?
I remember years back, they checked you in winner circle for sticker and product. That was it... you got paid if it was on the car. (been a while since I won LOL)
IHRA has new owners, and they have the chance to go to the companies right now and make deals... but they need to act fast! IHRA can let the companies in cheap, and at a lower cost, and get more people on board. Makes the racers happy??? and more cars at the track?

WIN WIN for everyone?

Fire away!

Ken

[Dan Fahey]

Originally Posted by Kegracing

OK, get ready to flame away... Just want to throw some ideas out there and see what people say. MAYBE we can help in some way.

I am guessing some of the new IHRA owners and their contacts are reading these boards, to see how people are reacting. Would love to hear from some of you, if this is true!

First, I would like to see the new owners of IHRA really get back behind the sportsman racers, and get the car counts back to where they were 10 years ago. I know the economy and a lot of other things impact this, but it is just not the same "family deal" it was several years back. NOT saying IHRA is bad now... I still support them, and still say they are the more friendly sportsman body! But, I think a lot of old time IHRA racers would agree with me...?

So, for the Contingency stickers: Would the average racer be happier to get a smaller payout for a win and RU if they were not held to such a tight rule on: recent purchases, having receipts, having to renew with company every year, etc. AND there was a lot more companies posting?
I remember years back, they checked you in winner circle for sticker and product. That was it... you got paid if it was on the car. (been a while since I won LOL)
IHRA has new owners, and they have the chance to go to the companies right now and make deals... but they need to act fast! IHRA can let the companies in cheap, and at a lower cost, and get more people on board. Makes the racers happy??? and more cars at the track?

WIN WIN for everyone?

Fire away!

Ken

Time to end nitty rules :

Like only using Race gas, especially for Stock and Super Stock
and
Recertifying or Buying new Seat Belt Harnesses every two years.

Engine and Car Certification should be made smoother.
Creating Certification centers.

Dan

[jmcarter]

Originally Posted by Dan Fahey

Time to end nitty rules :

Like only using Race gas, especially for Stock and Super Stock
and
Recertifying or Buying new Seat Belt Harnesses every two years.

Engine and Car Certification should be made smoother.
Creating Certification centers.

Dan

Know we've gripped endlessly about these and others...$11.00 racing gas in a 9 to 1 motor is ludicrous. Belts, and so many other rules are far more stringent than sactioning bodies such as SCCA where they emphasize safety even more, the list goes on and on and on....

[novassdude]

Ken I will have to assume that you do not own a company that pays contingency. The way that you explain how it should be would be great for racers and is pretty close to how it was for years. The problem with that system is people will take advantage of it. Just like went on before. You look in the dragster see who is paying for things like pistons and rings and that is who they put on for decals. Did not matter what was in the engine. You say if you have the sticker and the parts you should get paid. That may work well for some products but not for most. Are you willing to teardown to prove what is in the engine?
It is hard for a company to stay in business if they have to pay contingency on parts that are 10 years old or possibly not on a car at all.
It would be great if there was a better system. But you do need to keep the manufactures view in mind when coming up with a better plan. It needs to be a two way street.
Now one thing that should change is if you have the proper documentation at the end of the race it should be confirmed and paid on the spot.

[Kegracing]

Lot of views, but not many hits...

And while I started this about contingency money, please continue to post about other things too! Again, hopefully someone that matters will read some of this.

NovaSS, I respect your views, and no, I do not own a company. And you are correct, there are people that take advantage of situations. Will never get away from that completely. I am just trying to find a way to make it better. There are a few limited parts inside a motor or trans that are hard to see... MOST of parts on the list if you go back 10 years ago, when times were much better, are easy enough to see. We had multiple vendors paying for the same product, competing for our business... 3 tire companies, 3-4 seat belt companies, 3-4 converter companies, 3-4 wire and ignition companies, etc...
I had to pull a valve cover years ago, to show my rocker arms. Did not bother me, as it paid...
I am just trying to find ways that a new set of owners can try to help leverage some things for the better of the racers.
At the same time, it would be better for all the companies if there are more race cars out there actually going down the track! All companies related to the business would be better off, if more parts are being used. Cars sitting in the trailer, or not being built, do not sell parts to anyone.
We still have a few companies that try to make it easy for a win/ru to get paid. Summit and Jegs both shine in this area. A free catalog or free log book and stickers, and no questions ask. This is the type of service that makes you really appreciate a company, and want to support them. Granted, they have have both gotten rich from racers, BUT they do both give back! Lot of sponsorship at all levels from these companies. (and NO, I do not work for either... but have spent a lot with both over the years!)

Good luck to all. Season is about here!

Ken

[FED 387]

As little as about 8 years ago we could "earn" about $1300-1700 in qualifying monies @ a NHRA National Event with our Comp car using different products--that slowly went away til it no longer exists---not only that during this time the entry fees have increased dramatically and the PURSE has either remaind stagnant or gone up ever so little-IHRA for the most part in our area has disappeared I think because their format allowed no "breakout" in ET--- so basically it became ET racing---I do not care for ET racing---Most Comp racers do not like ET racing-- I have always thought it should be the first car to the stripe wins!!!-- I do not have a problem with handicap starts---
Going back a long time ago lotsa free products were given away to the racers at the track( lubricants/plugs/brake cleaner etc just to name a few), MSD freely did ignition repairs, and things of that nature-- then the HRA's(both) started charging the manufacturers HUGE amounts of money to be on the MIDWAY at an event and what happened is that before you knew it the mfg. had thousands of dollars paid out to be there in the hopes that the fans would see &might/would buy their products. Then next thing they knew they doubled what they were charging them----This coupled with the tremendous increase in spectator admission which caused decreases in attendence, the economy going sour, unemployment etc has caused many companies not just the little guys but the big ones to to rethink how they are going to do business------It is hard for the average racer or fan to understand the additional financial burden BOTH the HRA's have placed on the "sponsors" and why many no longer choose to participate or have cut back if not eliminated participation altogether.--- MY .02 ---FED 387

[Chuck Beach]

I think there are problems on both sides of the fence. I run stock eliminator and maybe put 40 to 50 runs on my car a year (6 races). At the end of each year I do some maintenance, freshen the tranny, change engine bearings .... etc. At this rate I could run the same engine for maybe 5 to 6 years before a complete engine rebuild. Looking at the internal parts at that time (connecting rods, pistons, camshaft, etc) do you think that they would need replaced after say 300 runs? Probably not. It would probably only take rings, bearings and freshened heads. If it's not broke don't fix it. Some manufacturers have a 3 year limitation on their parts. I have to ask ... do you buy a new computer every 3 years, do you buy a new mower every 3 years, do you buy a new heater and air conditioner every 3 years .... probably not. I would also have to ask, is this all the longer your parts will last? So why replace perfectly good parts with new ones just for the sake of contingency? Financially this would not make sence. Most of us would only replace these types of parts when necessary. So I can see where someone who doesn't race much could easily have 5 to 10 year old parts. I have a Turbo Action shifter that I have used since 1985. And how about the guy building a new car, sometimes that can take several years, his parts are already outdated before he goes down the track ...

I have suggested to some manufacturers to put SN#s on their parts and only pay maybe 5 or 6 times on that part or up to what that part costs new.

As far as the manufacturer is concerned, if they put the money up then they should pay regardless of the life of the part. I am Ok with proving to them that I use their product. My race car is a 1968 and I still get contigency for it ... lol

[randy wilson]

Yes FED, no break-out is what some racers want. Me included. What stopped me from comp, is not the endless work, but the endless head change allowance, and that brings money for new pistons, cams, rockers, lifters, heads, intakes, headers, and so on into play. I don't know the answer, but to bring the crowd back, you eventually have to actually race.

[Dan Fahey]

Originally Posted by jmcarter

Know we've gripped endlessly about these and others...$11.00 racing gas in a 9 to 1 motor is ludicrous. Belts, and so many other rules are far more stringent than sactioning bodies such as SCCA where they emphasize safety even more, the list goes on and on and on....

Thanks for the response...

IHRA needs to look at the rules that are over the top and address others that need attention.

How does NHRA get away with making rules more draconian and then racers still flock to their meets.

The numbers of complaints are huge..

Here is an opportunity for IHRA to get with a bunch of racers to reconfigure rules so they are beneficial to IHRA and to heck with NHRA.

The Gasoline and Seat Belts rules are two easy ones to fix.
We need to have others respond and add to this list.

Nobody seems to be advertising on the Radio about any of the races.
That would be a nice boost..

dan

[Michael Beard]

Some manufacturers have a 3 year limitation on their parts. I have to ask ... do you buy a new computer every 3 years, do you buy a new mower every 3 years, do you buy a new heater and air conditioner every 3 years .... probably not. I would also have to ask, is this all the longer your parts will last?

Who ever said that a contingency date requirement has anything to do with the life or quality of the product? Sales and coupons have expiration dates on them, too. This is basic math. It is not financially feasible for every company to pay for every product forever. Instead of demanding that a company "owes us something", I am grateful for the companies that do support our sport, however they are able! I would rather a company post with stipulations than not at all. If it's not worth keeping a receipt or making a phone call sometimes, that's a decision for an individual racer to make. The rules are clear up front.

So why replace perfectly good parts with new ones just for the sake of contingency?

Yes, that would be exactly the reason, IF that's what the qualifications are for that particular company/product. If you don't want to replace the part, you don't have to. You also don't have to claim contingency on it.

I have a Turbo Action shifter that I have used since 1985.

...and we expect Turbo Action to pay someone thousands of dollars over a lifetime for a $300 shifter (multiplied by how many racers?) and stay in business HOW?

I have suggested to some manufacturers to put SN#s on their parts and only pay maybe 5 or 6 times on that part or up to what that part costs new.

The first complaint was that a product was somehow 'no good' after 3 years, yet now it would be okay if a product was deemed 'no good' (by that same standard) after you won 'x' number of races with it? If that's what a company wanted to do, and the sanctioning bodies approved it, that's fine. It's a free market, and their choice on how to best market their products. This brings us back full circle to: Appreciate the sponsors for what they can do, play by the rules set by the sponsors and the sanctioning bodies, and if you don't want to play, then don't.

I am just trying to find ways that a new set of owners can try to help leverage some things for the better of the racers. At the same time, it would be better for all the companies if there are more race cars out there actually going down the track!

Correct. Who are they advertising to, how many people do they reach, and something many seem to be forgetting: what is their expected return on investment? Realistically, making a program LESS accountable does not achieve that goal.

A sponsor's primary considerations of a contingency program are 1) Advertising/Branding and 2) Sales. There are four legs associated with these objectives: 1) The sanctioning body 2) the racer 3) the fans 4) and the sponsor itself.

The sponsor is obviously going to do everything it can to leverage its own program. They interact with the fans with midway displays, promotional contests, etc. The racers display the requested contingency decals, so they do their part (in most cases... some choose to not provide sponsors with their full value in a number of ways). Some racers go the further and display additional decals on their trailer, pit vehicle, or tow vehicle, or display banners, etc. (when permitted)

Promoters are the link between the sponsor and their intended audience , both racers and fans. Sponsors provide advertising dollars to the promoter and/or augments the event as a whole with product, gift certificates, or cash payments direct to the racers such as contingency programs. Ultimately, even the direct "racer benefits" are a direct aid to the promoter, as it subsidizes the purse and awards, thus attracting larger numbers through the back gate, while ticket programs and/or advertising in partnership with sponsors yields larger front gate numbers. The remaining question then is, what else can a promoter do to provide additional value to the sponsor?