Why do we continually use the super classe as track testers?

[CBS]

This is a letter I received today......And I agree...we need to come up with a set of conditions to race.....

Rock,

I don't post here often. But this weekend's events at Atco have pushed me to the edge. I compromised and decided to send you a PM instead. Why do these Division Directors and race track operators continue to use S/ST, S/G, and S/C drivers as test pilots to see if the race track is suitable for racing? Especially during eliminations when your whole weekend is on the line and your judgement is suspect as a result?

I suggest we use the sportsman racers council for something more suitable than serving everyone's personal interests. How about we develop some technical guidelines for the directors to use to measure if it is suitable prior to sending a pair of cars down to find out? Perhaps the division could supply a temp gun to the starter to go measure the track temp down track. If it is under 70, we don't run (Indy - when Phillips/Langdon ran it was 64). Even better - how about one of those torque wrench based traction devices like the pros use? A minimun torque value for safe running could be established. Perhaps you could canvas the rest of the troops for ideas.

We need to lend a little science to this issue rather than relying on the gut feel of the starter scuffing his feet or a division director that is up in the tower sipping coffee. It is obvious that they do not understand the unique requirements associated with high horsepower, 2100#, throttle stop equipped cars with very low wheel speed going wide open 300 feet out. Mix in an unwillingness to lift because it's eliminations and you have a recipe for disaster.

[Alan Roehrich]

Rock, they don't always use the .90 Super Class racers to test the track. They also use Stock, we don't call ourselves "alarm Stock" and "crash test dummies" for nothing. Hell, I've been on a track loose enough that a low HP stick car spun hard on all three gear changes.

You know that I have friends, including you, that race those classes. And we all know that what causes the problem for the .90 Super class guys is they go on the stop about 1 foot into the run, hold about 800-1000HP or more, and go wide open off the stop instantly. So they're already down track a ways, where there's less grip than on the starting line, and they're coasting along, then hit the looser section of the track, and an unloaded car, with well over 800HP in a tenth of a second. The fact is, the .90 Super Class guys know full well what they're asking of the track and the cars, and they are their own worst enemy. Using 700HP to run 10.90, or 850HP to run 9.90, or 1200HP to run 8.90, is going to create a nasty problem if the track isn't great.

Yes, there should be minimum standards for the track. We've all seen tracks that either weren't prepped, or couldn't be "brought around".

Let's not make this an issue of who they use as a track tester. It's no more fair to put a guy in a $50K Stock Eliminator car on a loose track than it is to put a guy in a $50K Super Gas car on a loose track. The idea that a 9" tire Stock Eliminator car with 600HP should go down a track to see if it will work for .90 Super Class cars is just as absurd.

[Chad Rhodes]

I agree with Alan. Just another reason to either lower the indexes, take off the stops, or institute a MPH limit in the super classes.

[Andys dad]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

Rock, they don't always use the .90 Super Class racers to test the track. They also use Stock, we don't call ourselves "alarm Stock" and "crash test dummies" for nothing. Hell, I've been on a track loose enough that a low HP stick car spun hard on all three gear changes.

You know that I have friends, including you, that race those classes. And we all know that what causes the problem for the .90 Super class guys is they go on the stop about 1 foot into the run, hold about 800-1000HP or more, and go wide open off the stop instantly. So they're already down track a ways, where there's less grip than on the starting line, and they're coasting along, then hit the looser section of the track, and an unloaded car, with well over 800HP in a tenth of a second. The fact is, the .90 Super Class guys know full well what they're asking of the track and the cars, and they are their own worst enemy. Using 700HP to run 10.90, or 850HP to run 9.90, or 1200HP to run 8.90, is going to create a nasty problem if the track isn't great.

Yes, there should be minimum standards for the track. We've all seen tracks that either weren't prepped, or couldn't be "brought around".

Let's not make this an issue of who they use as a track tester. It's no more fair to put a guy in a $50K Stock Eliminator car on a loose track than it is to put a guy in a $50K Super Gas car on a loose track. The idea that a 9" tire Stock Eliminator car with 600HP should go down a track to see if it will work for .90 Super Class cars is just as absurd.

Man I don't often agree with you but this was "dead nuts", "spot on" really to the point.

[Alan Roehrich]

I'm not making an indictment of the .90 Super Class guys. We campaigned a Super Comp dragster and a Super Gas Camaro 20 years ago. They're doing different things on the same piece of asphalt with us.

I don't want to see anyone wreck their car or anyone else's car.

But the solution to the problem is not to complain that Super Street is usually the first class out, if they run Super Street at that particular event.

The solution is to fix the damned track. After that first pair gets out of shape, everyone needs to get out of their car and just stop. Don't pull forward in the lanes, don't do a burnout, don't stage. Just stop, get out, take your helmet off, and stand there until they fix the track.

If you see the track is absolutely unsafe, don't get on the track. It's that simple.

If enough people take a stand (yeah, that's asking a lot), they won't have much choice.

[Nitro Joe Jackson]

Because they know you Super class guys want to go 200 mph and are nuts on those stupid timers (which should be outlawed) and if, I say if Super classes did not have timers and went back to the old style throttle stops we would cut down big time on crashes. I know, I'm a broken record but damn it, it's the truth.

Bottom line does anybody know how much a track needs extra preped for the Super class cars timers to come back on past the 60 ft mark and on, it has to be as the starting line or better.
This is one of the main reasons a lot of tracks have done away with their super class programs.

[chebby2]

Here we go again.

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Nitro Joe Jackson

Because they know you Super class guys want to go 200 mph and are nuts on those stupid timers (which should be outlawed) and if, I say if Super classes did not have timers and went back to the old style throttle stops we would cut down big time on crashes. I know, I'm a broken record but damn it, it's the truth.

Joe,
Almost 24 years ago, I was sitting in the lounge of the Holiday Inn, across from the "New Atlanta Dragway". Lex Dudas was working for NHRA, and he was sitting at the next table. He said "we ought to take every delay box and every throttle stop in the world, pile them up, I'll run them over with a bulldozer and we'll set them on fire." I'm not sure it wouldn't have been a good idea.

We were running two dragsters in Super Comp that weekend. We saw a guy in the lanes fire his S/C dragster up in reverse and back all the way up to the roll cage of the car behind him. The rear end would have been in the driver's lap. The next week, we all had to have neutral safety switches.

[Michael Beard]

This isn't about classes. The track was junk for a lot of cars in a lot of classes, and it's more than a shame to take a mostly sunny 60 degree day, ball up a couple of cars and send people home.

[CBS]

I was only posting a letter I got......any car on an unsafe track is an issue.....Stop with the throttle stop stuff....its about the track....

The point is maybe we can get some data together that may lead to a base standard of track conditions.....

"We have been looking at track preparation issues all season long.
There are definitely steps that can be taken to improve things. Please see the attached letter from my racing partner who is an engineer at Roush.

In response to the point about a minimum track temperature, we have made good runs on tracks that had temperatures as low as 54 and made bad runs on tracks that were 65 or more. Unfortunately there is not just one measure of track adhesion quality. Your grip meter torque device idea is sound, although it is going to take time to build a database to determine what torque and what track position will work for most cars. One S/C car at Atco runs over 200 mph, what track criteria does he need? I sure dont want to make that call.

As far as the Division Director in this case, Bob Lang, sipping coffee in the tower, Bob was on the track dealing with the traction issue all event long.

My racing partner spoke with the Atco track owner Joe Sway, when we were leaving, and Joe was heartbroken that they could not come up with a solution to the traction issue. I feel like they put the best effort possible to provide a suitable race track, but ultimately could not.

Here is My partners letter......

Observations regarding track preparation

Forward:
This seasons most popular topic of discussion has been track preparation. Have adjustments to the track prep procedure been made in an attempt to minimize tire chunking in the fuel classes? Sportsman racing postponed at Phoenix. Super Comp cars not able to negotiate the right lanes at Charlotte. More sportsman crashes than many can remember. Perhaps the risk and liability of the fuel cars blowing a tire have caused changes to be made. But it is undeniable. Something has changed. There is a new fuel tire now, and conditions at Topeka were excellent. Perhaps the issues have been fixed. Even if there has been a change in the formula or application of the traction compound there are a number of procedures that could lead to more consistent and equally performing lanes.
In today’s industry and business world, procedures are everything. ISO compliance is mandatory. Why? So the results are predictable and repeatable. The following is a series of observations and facts from attending National events and discussions with racers, track operators and the guys actually preparing the track(s).

There are a huge number of variables to deal with when it comes to track preparation.

Weather variables;
Temperature, wind, sun, humidity and rain.

Track surface variables;
Paving surface finish, amount of aggregate, concrete mixture, amount and type of rubber on the surface along with how well it is adhered. Bumps, ruts and transitions add another dimension to the equation.

Track preparation variables;
1) Sweeping with the tractor: It is not uncommon for the tractor to drive 100’ downtrack with the sweeper brush down and rotating, then lift the sweeper, turn around and head back to the starting line. Where does the pile of debris go?
How to resolve this issue?
a) Sweep both lanes only in one direction, toward the starting line and through to beside the water box.
b) Run the vacuum truck to vacuum up the pile left by the tractor.

2) Dragging with the tractor(s): The dragging process appears to be done with consistency, but the process may be flawed. In most situations the tractor driver alternates directions between lanes, and may always go toward the water box in the left lane and away from the water in the right lane. Imagine the rubber that is adhered to the track surface as small flakes, these flakes are folded back to the starting line by the action of the rotation of the rear tires during the course of a run. By running the drag in the direction of the track, these microscopic flakes may actually be “stood up” or torn off during the dragging process. In some cases two tractors are used. How can you be certain that the pressure on the drag is the same?
How to resolve this situation?
a) Drag both lanes in only one direction, opposite of the direction the cars run.
b) If two tractors are used, alternate lanes between track prep sessions.

3) Application of traction compound, (spray) downtrack: The speed and direction of the wind have a marked impact on the amount of the spray that is applied. You can see a visible difference in the “wetness” of the application dependant on the direction the spray is applied. Almost always, the spray is applied up one lane and down the other.
How to resolve this issue?
Spray both lanes only in one direction, in the direction that yields the maximum product to track ratio.

4) Application of traction compound, starting line: The wind also has an impact on the spray applied by the manual sprayer. There are many inconsistencies in this manual application process.
How to resolve this issue?
Pay closer attention to ensure even application. Put procedures in place.

4) Traction compound:
a) There are many questions as to the formulation and consistency of the product.
b) There are multiple variables in the mixing of the traction compound by the end user(s). The type of reducing agent (solvent/thinner) can vary as well as the mixing ratios being varied based on relative humidity. The actual mixing process is often done in the tank mounted on the sprayer, with no means to insure a homogenous mixture.
c) There is no method in place to measure the actual ratio of traction compound to reducing agent prior to application. A portion of the reducing agent can evaporate in a “batch” that has been sitting for only a few hours.

How to resolve these issues?
a) Have the product periodically tested by an independent laboratory.
b) Set procedures for mixing criteria and change from using relative humidity to an absolute measure of water content in the air, like grains of water per pound.
c) Use of an electric drill driven mixer.
d) Put in place a system to measure the actual ratio of the traction compound and document each application.

The men and women of the Safety Safari work tirelessly to prepare the tracks for competition. Their efforts should be applauded, but I believe that it is time to stop and look at the track preparation procedures and get away from “that’s the way we’ve always done it” mentality.

Its time we had this discussion.....