unequal four link for super stocker
 

Some years ago 3rd gen Camaros and Firebirds were built with short upper four-link bars. Ed Quay and others offered frame rails and other hardware to product those builds.

Question; is there any downside to the short upper bar? Does that design react/operate the same as an equal length four link?

If would be for a small block powered package with an ET range of 9.50's

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

They tend to be on the violent side when used with a manual transmission or a transbrake, and a bit less friendly to tune. Footbrake cars that don't have a ton of torque or a lot of gear seem to work well.

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

Ed Quay built my Monte back in 85 with short upper bars. After a lot of playing with it then having a chance to play with equal 4 link bar car I found that any changes to short upper bar seemed like drastic large swings even though you moved 1 hole or changed ride height. The equal bar car when making the same changed seemed more tune able. The Monte worked well but maybe I didn't have enough knowledge back then to figure out little changes.

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

We eventually had Kronenbitter cut out our short bar and converted it to long bar. Like the other guys said, short bars are touchy. For a bracket car that never changes anything,they would be dandy. Really no problem hooking them. But changes in ride height along with changes in tire diameter, makes a perfect acting car act stupid. You cant throw 150 lbs ( sometimes more), in and out of them, and not have issues....

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

Larry,
The bars on my car are:
Top - 20" C-C
Bottom 22: C-C
The 4 link bracket on the rear end has an 8 deg forward tilt
off of vertical for the top mount.
You will probably have better luck with that than just a vertical on center
rear end bracket. My car liked it even though it shortened the top bar.
Call me if you want the mount distance off the C/L of the housing
and bar angles.

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

Larry,

Trying to figure out how to adjust our suspension, we found this spreadsheet on the Internet which helped us understand why our car was reacting as it did. It answered a lot of our questions and allowed us to get our car to work pretty good. This same information is available in some of the chassis setup books available.

http://www.patooyee.com/calculators/4BarLinkV3.0c.xls

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

I appreciate everyone's feedback.

The reason for my question, I am looking at a 3rd gen Camaro that is fitted with the Ed Quay style link. That design is from the days when NHRA rules did not allow the floor to be cut for suspension install.

The upper bar is considerably shorter than the lower bar per the Quay design.

My research shows the Quay design is in service with successful racers.

Given this updated information, do y'all have any additional feedback?

Is the Quay design acceptable for a small block powered package running in the 9.30 ET range?

A trans brake launch with engine of about 650 - 670 horse?

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

My SS/BM Cavalier has a short top bar style four link and we have never had any issues with it and it is very tune-able. We have run the car with a 500 HP GT motor all the way up to the 865 HP modified motor that we have in it today. I know a number of years ago a lot of guys were changing them out, but I think it was a little bit monkey see monkey do.
I know there are a ton of cars out there like mine. I wouldn't be scare of that set-up one bit. If building a car from scratch I'm not sure I would do it, but definitely not worth changing.

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

Ed Quay told me Via Facebook just recently why he favored those short top bars and it made sense.

He felt equal length bars could get into a bind easier.

His dragsters used the same shorter top bar style 4 link.

My good friend has one and I know of others and they work well.


I had a short wheelbase Vega and it was originally a 3 link

It had extreme body roll using a trans brake and I cut it out and installed an Art Morrison 4 link with short top bars due to limited space.

Car worked fine and I ran as quick as 9.30 footbraking.....and used a trans brake for S/G .....

The next owner ran some 8.80's with it and added an anti roll bar and a strut front end to replace the a-arms that it was built with.....

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

With hole spacing being the same on the chassis bracket, the shorter bar will be a much more drastic change when moving the front up or down a hole. It can go from too much angle to not enough, (too much change in IC location), with no way to split the difference other than a ride height change.

Also, the IC change throughout the normal rear housing movement will be much greater, depending on how much the rear moves. Even if you've found the sweet spot, this can still cause problems.

IMO, the short bars were a compromise for the situation at the time. The trend now is to make the adjustments finer, with smaller holes in brackets, tighter center-to centers, multi piece brackets allowing for 1/8" changes in location, and/or longer bars making this so.

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

While I agree the adjustment is more drastic with the short top bar, if you move the mounting location on the rear housing to one of the other holes you can find a middle ground. First thing you need to do is draw out and plot the IC of all combinations. This will tell you what next closest move is.

I built two Camaros with Quay kits. I put what Ed wanted for the initial bar and shock settings on the first car. Worked great, just made changes to front shocks/limiters for track changes.

Second car didn't work out so good during shakedown, had convertor/gearing issues. During this time I changed bar settings, ride height and shock settings. Dug out my notes from Ed, put back to his initial settings. Went looking elsewhere and found the issues. Rear is still at these settings, just adjust the Santhuff struts extention 1/4 turn max either way depending on track.

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

Thanks to all who replied, I appreciate the information.

I did buy the car and will post updates later.

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

I run unequal length bars on my 4 link. I am always looking for new info. Could you elaborate on how Ed wanted the bars set up?

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

it begins! I will and an anti-roll bar kit

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

If it was me, I would lower the front of the upper bar by at least one hole. Kinda funky geometry the way it is now...

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

notice that no shocks are installed and that a jack stand is holding the housing in that position.

I will contact Quay and set the initial adjustments per their recommendation. Doing that is some time away. Lots of areas of attention to address before the final setup takes place.

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

Bottom bar 2 degrees down towards front of car. Notice in the pic provided the bottom bar is in the upper hole on rear. Both rear housing mounts should be in outer holes. When lower bar moved to outer housing hole, the rear will need to go up into chassis. This will increase downward angle of top bar. I believe the top bar in pic is in preferred initial location. Shock settings should provide minimal chassis separation or squat.

Re: unequal four link for super stocker
 

Thanks Bert