nhra w/sa
 

hey, I'm new to the forum and stock racing. I'm thinking about building a 1998 s10 4cyl for w/sa. if I'm right has to be a extended cab to meet 24.00 rule. the question is will that 4 cyl run good enough. is there a recommended engine shop and trans shop for this app. also if anybody recommends a better choice vehicle I'm open to all options. any help at all is appreciated. thanks

Re: nhra w/sa
 

The S-10's came with what we called the thrashing 2.5. Never looked to see what the HP#'s were on it.

Honestly I've always wondered about the 2.8/2.9L in the newer Canyon/Colorado's. We picked it for an Engine in comp because of the combustion chamber and Head flow #'s. I bet it would make a Fast Stocker. A pain to tear down due to the DOHC but fast.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Later S-10s had 2.2L motor. I don't know about them as "race" motors but other than some headgasket problems (aluminum head iron block), I always thought they were a pretty good motor. You can adjust the bodys up or down a class.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

ahh yes, the 2.2 was almost identical to the engine that cane in the cavaliers/sunfires

Re: nhra w/sa
 

It has the 2.2 and heads and gaskets are a problem but there plenty out there. I think class min is 16.00 in 1/8 mile. Does it have to run that to race or faster then that for a record. I have raced lots of nitrous stuff and index like 6.0 and 4.70 but stock is all new and looks like a great challenge

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Go to the top of this page. Click on NHRA competition icon. on the left side of the page under Tech, click on Rules. Familiarize yourself with the rules. Then go to Dwight Southerland's site, you can get to it from the classracer home page.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

HP is too high, IMO.
It got hit 5 when the truck indexes were soft.
Rather see you build an 82 Firebird/ Camaro for W/SA ..Bigger engine, less HP.Still fuel injection.
You have to dial 16.65 or faster in the quarter mile. Don't know where you can run S/SS in the 1/8th.
Should be able to budget build one to run .65 under. Cam blanks, header parts, trans cases readily available.
Can't recommend an engine/ trans builder near you until you fill out your profile more completely.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Firebird would be a 2.5 engine? I considered a camaro berlinetta with a 2.5 but couldn't find one I'd rather have a car v/s a truck if I could find one. I'll try to complete the profile but I'm near Charlotte nc there are some 1/8 mile divisional races at galot rockingham I think z max that's were I'd get started to earn a chance to run a national. Thanks

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Ok Billy I read some of the rules and I'm confused a bit. If I use a regular cab s10 that puts me in u class but I can add weight to the truck and run w is that how it works. ( if I can find a camaro or firebird I will but I have the truck worst case). Thanks for all the help

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Yes, that is how it works. If you are using my website information, it will show you all the classes you can run with the '98 S10 4cyl, plus the weights of the car (or truck) for each class and the indexes you have to run. 3266 lbs, for W/SA, 3146 for W/S. The regular cab short box truck fits W by adding weight.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Dwight I haven't found your site I have looked. I'd love to look at it. Thanks

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Go to classracerinfo.com
It will answer all of your class/weight issues.
i think that the biggest concern that Mark has is the relatively high HP on the 2.2. That combo has been done before and gotten hit with HP. Just as an example of the things to look for when trying to pick a combo, Mark suggested the 82 Camaro with a 2.5 at 120 HP. An 85 Camaro with a 2.5 has much more compression and is rated at 115 HP. Now the compression is nice but that 5 HP in a 24 lb. class is 120 lbs!
If you're bound-and-determined to do an S-10, then look at an 85 S-10 with the 2.5. 14 HP less than the 98 2.2. That's over 330 lbs. more weight that the 2.2 has to carry to run W. But you DO own the 98 and it's probably easier to find parts for.
The main thing that I should impress on you is not to let the ravings of a couple of Mad Men discourage you. The fact that the 2.2 at one time ran fast enough to get hit with HP means something.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

I looked in class racer info I need to register thanks. I'm not set on the truck just because I have it camaro would be great if I can find one and would use a ford or whatever. I see this takes lots of thought and reading I have a lot to learn. Thanks for the help Billy and everyone else it's starting to sink in I would like to set a record if at all possible.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

You're right. It took me about 6 months of looking through the charts and doing the math before I figured out a combo to try. And it was still a real leap of faith!

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Billy can I get a 85 camaro and then ( per rule book). Try to find a correct year 2.5 out of some other car and use that engine in the camaro if so I need to see what the block and head numbers are the same for multiple years. I can use any rear end that's a gm as long as it's the same length. And transmission can be any gm automatic.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

You can use an engine out of another car as long as it is the same as the Camaro.
You can use any GM rear. You can use any GM 3 speed or in the case of an 85 Camaro 4 speed GM auto.
You REALLY need to join Dwight's site.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

You can use any 151 block, as long as the bore and stroke is correct.
You don't want a block with the FWD bolt pattern.Might want to look at late 70's Monza, Sunbird, etc. I believe they had the traditional Chevy RWD pattern. Either that ,or the BOP pattern.
Use a T 200 with the 2.74 low, the 7.5 rear, with as much gear as they make, and a pair of 23- 24" M&H's . Should be okay, the dime rocket way!

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Thanks a bunch Billy and mark. I will join or register dwights site soon as I get home the phone is not working out for joining.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Joined the info site. Lots of help there. I have a plan now.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Go with a 2.91 low

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Hey, hey, easy now! Big price difference. Why I didn't mention it at first.
Looks like 4.56 is it , on the gear ratios. Short tires make it like a 5.0 something

Re: nhra w/sa
 

I've got a pair of '82-'85 Camaro 2.5 (Iron Duke) frame mounts if you're interested.
Considered doing one of those myself at one time, but ran out of steam. Me, not the combo.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

What about building one with a stick? I had one of those 4 cylinder Camaros back in the late eighties/ early nineties with a 4 speed. I bought it with the intention of making it into a race car, but never considered to build it with the 4 cylinder. I had a buddy that had one and it was faster than my V6 automatic Camaro. I would check Nitro Joe's stats and see which class has less participation, W/S or W/SA.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Billy, mark . For the 1985 camaro 2.5 I have found a nos head cast number 10022373 per dwights site in engine specs and bought it. The specs say the intake cast number is 100180018 and j can't find one of those yet. Is that the only number intake I can use. Who in the nhra teck should I call and talk to about this. Thanks again

Re: nhra w/sa
 

You have to use the one listed, if there is no alternate listed as a foot note.
S10 is different, but 6000, Grand Am , Fiero, Celebrity, all the same 8018 in '85.
Look under Pontiac. Shouldn't be hard to find. Search the junkyard hotline on the 'net.

(you've got an extra digit in the part number.Might be the problem)

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Found an intake now on to trying to find a throttle body with the right numbers. And a block and crank should be easy to find.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Throttle bodies and carbs don't have to be the correct number.Just the correct size and an OEM model or approved replacement.
In you're case, with no size listed, I'd call NHRA...No, I wouldn't ,but you can call them and ask for the size, if you are so inclined.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Let me know what you want for them. Charles

Re: nhra w/sa
 

If anybody knows if a 2.5 short block or just a block with a chevy bell bolt pattern I'm in need of one. I think it's a iron duke

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Double post sorry

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Ya know, just a little bit of advice, it seems to me that you don't have a car yet from the way that you are looking for parts. When ever I want to "play" with a combo that I'm not too familiar with, I try to get a running car or at least one that I can make into a running car to start out. Sometimes this will save a whole lot of time and money and lead to a decision as to how far to go. Some combos just don't come up to expectations (aah, the 2.5 Fiero SE for W/SA).
This Camaro is going to probably run the index OK but to proceed with it, it is going to get expensive in a hurry. The trans isn't going to be cheap at all once you start moving forward. It'll probably need a 7" converter and you're going to have AT LEAST a 12 bolt in it to get enough gear. Best bet would be to find (Good luck!) a Dana 44 service package rear from an 82-83 Camaro.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

I have found a fiero but its a 6 cyl. The camaro with a 2.5 already in it is non existent lol. I did stumble across a fairmont 4 door 4 cyl that's very tempting but they want 6k and its bone stock but all there. I think if I can use a 87 s10 2.5 block and 700 r4 (i know the gear ratio is terrible from 1st to second) but that stuff is available I can't find a throttle body but I can't get in touch with anybody from nhra yet to see what I can use as there is no size listed. THE ONE THING I NEED INFO On FOR SURE IS WHAT TO DO ABOUT CONTROLLING THE INJECTOR what aftermarket system I can use and who to hire to get a fuel map. I think I can round up a body and 12 bolt strange has one. The other thing is i don't understand all the rules yet. A guy told me I didn't have to have a 1985 camaro that any body would work I just had to claim it was 1985. With all that said will a 1987 s10 block be legal thank fellas. Ps I'd like to call bill or mark one day or anybody willing to talk and give me a general run down of what and how nhra stock works . My number if any body wants to txt me or call is 704-718-6905

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Billy, I just figured since I had to build a motor anyway I'd be easier to but the parts since I haven't found a complete motor. I do understand that I may end up with a expensive piece of yard art if it won't run haha but I am only 335 dollars deep in the camaro so I can still do any combo that works out and go with stick or auto at this point. Thanks again

Re: nhra w/sa
 

If I were wanting a stocker and could not build my own I would consider Mike Graham's U/SA Maverick. It's ready to race and fast.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

I can build the car no problem as far as doing the work I just don't know what parts will work and be legal. I did see that maveric and it's a great deal I'm just stuck on w that's what I'm gonna fix right or wrong I just wanna mess with a 4 cylinder. Thanks again everyone

Re: nhra w/sa
 

If your still interested in an s10 with 2.2 for w/sa give me a call

cell 901-268-5376 work 800-233-3965

Ronnie Charnes

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Give these guys a call, they probably have what you're looking for.

http://www.davidt.com/vehicles/2/16/0/0/328

Re: nhra w/sa
 

Very helpful. Thank you sir

Re: nhra w/sa
 

You're welcome. I would like to see a 4 cylinder Camaro build.

Re: nhra w/sa
 

I applaud your desire and effort to build and race a combo that's against the norm. I found my originally bought '76 Chevy Vega that I won 7 bracket races in 8 final rounds between '77 and '79, and also was the lone semi-finalist in Street Eliminator at the '79 Division Five ET Finals, because I too wanted to run W/SA. However, the original 140ci 4cyl engine was replaced with a 151ci Iron Duke Ponfiac motor, and even worse it had a 5spd manual transmission instead of my originally equipped Turbo Hydro 250 automatic. I sadly walked away from my first new car because I felt it would be too hard to find that engine/tranny combo in '93. However, after I saw a Z24 Cavalier in an IHRA Stock Eliminator final round, I had to have one, and found one that was exactly like that one, and am enjoying the challenge of racing an otherwise odd combo, although it hasn't been easy o'er the years, but it's definitely a dime rocket!

I wish you all the best in whatever combo you campaign, and I look forward to seeing the finished product, especially on the strip!