Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Anyone want to chime in on 440 Dusters and Demons? I've got 3 Mopar buddies that I have breakfast with on Saturdays and they were talking about these cars. Now I'm a Chevy guy and I admit I've been wrong on many things, but when I told them "No such animal from the factory," they looked at me like I was crazy. I told them in over 40 years of following Stock and Superstock, you'd think we'd run across one by now, if they ever existed. Now , I'm just a kid of 59, and these guys are in their 60s, but I don't recall one of these being offered from Mopar.
One of them grabbed his smartphone and showed some pictures of one in Lime Green with the black 440 stripes down the side, and I told him "Its got to be true if its on the internet, right?" So another tells me about the flat black hoods with the 440 printed at an angle,, and I said those were '71 340 cars.
Perhaps Mr. Norm or somebody built these,, but I'm sticking by my claim that Plymouth and Dodge never built this combo,, and I'd buy them breakfast next week if they can provide proof,, not just somebody's picture of a homebuilt, since I've seen plenty of 440 Dusters and Demons at the drags over the years,, but not factory built.
I've got faith in my Classracer.com brothers and sisters,, so help me either put my tail between my legs or stick my chest out.
I brought my copy of Muscle Car Chronicle with me and told them to find one and they couldn't,, so maybe the "authors" missed these. You think?
Sorry for being so long winded,, but thanks for any input.
Danny Durham

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

I know there are 383 (and 440) Darts and Cudas But I've never heard of a big block Duster or Demon.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Danny I side with you , the only big block dusters I have ever seen were cobled together. But what do I know, I not over forty and I am a gm guy :)

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Never was there a big block Duster or Demon, only '68-'69 Darts and Barracudas.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Raise your tail Danny, no factory big block Dusters or Demons.

Leonard Johnson 4445 STK

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Danny, it looks like your buddies owe you a breakfast next week, lol...the biggest motor available in a 70-71 Duster or Demon was the 340 engine and a 360 was offered in later models...

http://encarsglobe.com/data_images/m...-duster-05.jpg

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

No factory big block Duster or Demon's were ever built.There was a deal that I think Tom Hoover proposed as a factory race car (like the 68 SS/AA cars) using a big block in a Demon for SS/CA,but it never happened.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

No such thing. I used to work at Chrysler Proving Grounds in those days and if we had any thing like that I would have known.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Nope.........Only A Body Big Blocks were in 1967 to 1969 A Bodys in Dart GTS only
and Barracuda Formula S and also a few 1969 "Cuda 440" non S models.

The 440 M code was factory available in the last month or two of 1969
Plymouth production thru all Plymouth Dealers.

The 69 Dart M code 440s .... I have seen back then were ONLY at Mr. Norms and
Saddleback Dodge in Tustin. They told me back then
that they had to order for stock a quantity of 20 at one time
to acquire them

In 68 I have only seen 440 Darts from Mr. Norms and no other one at all.

In latter part of 1967 Model you could get a 383 Dart GTS and Barracuda S

That is the best my ancient memory tells me from those days I did own
two of the Blue GTSs from Saddleback Dodge.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

They made 1969 440 darts and cudas only. They were the only production 440 a body mopar ever built. I happen to own one. They are neat cars but mopar never did it again. As John said they were M code cars.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

This is the biggest motor from the factory in a Demon back then...but I believe Mr Norm offered a 340 six pack & super charged version.

http://www.lhmopars.com/MOPAR_Ads/71spad6.jpg

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Correct Paul..........They did make '69 440 Barracuda M code
440 as well late in year. Dave Phillips has or had one
( He raced Superbee at 440at our old track ). I have only seen about 3 of them!

Paul: Merry Christmas to your family.

Looking forward to seeing you next season!

Irving Family Racing

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

It's too bad they didn't build the Six Pack cars as A-bodies instead of the A12 B-bodies. I've read it was considered, but nixed. It would have been a killer car.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Yes, the 68 GSS Dart. Which is why they are legal for super stock.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

I've read about these cars too. Mopar Action ran an article on a "what if" factory '71 440 Demon SS/CA a while back. This is as close to factory production the Demons and Dusters ever got.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

my dad had a m-code barracuda for a company car [he worked for chrysler corp] awesome car --b3 with blue interior---wish i knew where it ended up--in and around 1973 one showed up at car lot in webster ma--gold w/fenderwell headers--that disappeared within a week--but this thread is not about those cars---sorry--dave

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Not directly related to the original question, but I wonder if the MoPar experts can tell me what the deal was with the 68-69(?) Barracudas I`ve seen that had 2 small scoops at the back of the hood. I haven`t seem one of these cars in quite a while, but I do remember seeing a few, notably a yellow 340 car, and a bronze big block car.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

The Barracudas that had 2 small scoops at the back of the hood were the first CUDA's, from the 69 models year. They had decals on the front fender 'CUAD340, 'CUDA 383, and 'CUDA 440. A56 was the 340, A57 was 383, They are rare cars, production #'s are: 340 coupe 98, 383 coupe 83. 340 Fastback 568, 383 fastback 378. I have no numbers for the 'CUDA 440.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Danny,,,,

They owe you a breakfast, so eat light the night before.

A 440 was never installed in a factory 1970 and later A-Body.

The 440 was available in the Mr. Norms 1968 GSS Dart, but only
50 or so were available thru Grand Spaulding Dodge, or affiliated
Dealerships.

And '6' 1968 440 GTS Darts were specially built for 'designated racers only'
prior to the 1968 NHRA Winternationals.

* Dick Landy
* Charlie Allen (Saddleback Dodge)
* Ron Mancini (Greater Detroit Dodge Dealers)
* Los Angeles and Orange County Dodge Dealers (California)
* Friedman Motors (Des Moines, Iowa)
* Rockville Center Dodge (Rockville Center, New York)

The 'only' regular production 440 'Super Commando' came through in the,,,,, 1969 Dart 440 GTS and 440 'Cuda.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

A-Body 440 M-Code production numbers

* Dart 440 GTS M-Code......727 built
* 440 'Cuda M-Code.............344 built (299 Fastback and 45 Notchback)

First Build Date.....December 1, 1968
Last Build Date.....May 18, 1969

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

I have a letter from Carroll Shelby that says . . .

(beat you to it, Larry!)

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Now THATS funny,,, Greg,, nice pull.
I want to thank all you guys for jumping in. I was pretty sure I had this one right, but I've got more "bullets in my belt", now,, besides, I even went as far as to check out the NHRA classification guide and you all know what I didn't find in there.
I'm going to send these yahoos a link to our thread here, then sit back and enjoy the ride. I've known them all since the '60s when we were in school, so this is just the latest round in our always evolving life story, where they've gotten me plenty of times.
Merry Christmas everyone.
Danny Durham

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Danny maybe tell them to join in on the fun here, the more the merrier...and I also see this in your future...waffles & breakfast sausages.

http://recollectionsofplay.files.wor...05/waffles.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_YzCXKURwNV...inksausage.jpg

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

You know, this is a lot like the argument I've had several times with Chevy guys that think 1957 Chevy's came with a 327.

JimR

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Yeah,,, and the idiots that swear you could get a '67 Chevy II with a 396,,,, heard that one too!
Danny Durham

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Jim,

They did, all those guys that were winning those Junior Stock Classes
from 1966 thru 1969 were running 327's in their 1957 cars, while claiming they were 283's.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

You are kidding, right?

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

A couple years ago Mr. Norm's tried to release "recreations" of the SS/CA package car that never was, maybe that's where the confusion arose?

IIRC, it was supposed to use a 440 shortblock with Max Wedge heads and intake.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Naw,,, trust me. These 3 were confused long before that!
Danny Durham

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Ed,

In the Northeast, (New York , Connecticut and Milton, Vermont and
Orange Dragstrip in Massachusetts.

Nearly the whole lot of 57' Chevy's were running 327's while claiming a 283 in Stock Class.

In 1968, I saw my fair share of 57' Chevy BelAir's running a supposed
283/270 HP Dual-Quad in I/Stock, hitting 12.90's while on the
brakes, on a regular basis.

These guys went from running 14.10's to 12.90's (on the brakes) in the span of 1-week, after getting their engines 'done'.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Got to drive a Mr Norms Demon that was a trade in when I worked at a Dodge dealer while in school. A real treat moving it in snow and rain with those little tires.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

??????? Those dual quad cars would easily run 12.70's on a good day with a legal 283. We were torn down several times so everyone knew it wasn't a 327. As the camshafts evolved, the car would run quicker as a 245 hp than a 270.

Jim Mantle V/SA 6632

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

If you were like me, tech guys were feeling the sides of the block for motor mount bosses until they knew you had been torn down. Between setting records and protests, they all knew my '56 was a 265".

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Maybe we can start a new thread,

Northeast 283's = 327 cubic inches.

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

I'd bet the Lime Green Duster was built by my friend Charlie. He built the car took look like a factory car. When it was done, he got bored of it quick and sold it. His work is fantastic.
Chris

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

What if...

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3641/3...b76ea39e_z.jpg

http://i660.photobucket.com/albums/u...8/IMG_2574.jpg

http://www.moparpowerclub.com/Glenn_...Duster_440.JPG

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

HM,, you've got that right. 3 nice photos of some "what ifs". Breakfast is in the morning,, we'll see how it goes.
Danny Durham

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

4.06x4.06x4.25x.7854x8=440ci "SMALL BLOCK" WEDGE

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

...so how was breakfast today. :)

http://www.fatwallet.com/static/atta...house_menu.jpg

Re: Mopar racers,,, help me settle a bet.
 

Breakfast was great,,, about 10 of us showed up including the 3 brothers who are Mopar fanatics and lifelong friends of mine. Strange,,, but they were unusually quiet this morning when I mentioned this thread. The middle brother alluded to something about not being able to find this on his computer,, imagine that! The Ford guys sitting at the table next to us wanted to know what that smoke was that was coming from under their chairs!
I bought my own biscuits and gravy today, but seeing them squirm a little was worth the price of admission,,, actually the Ford guys were glad for once we were'nt ganging up on them!
Danny Durham