Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Well running 13 ohs most days, high 12's cool days.
K/SA is a 12.65 minimum based on what my car would easily weigh.
Would need a Roll Bar, small gas tank.
Have an 8.5 inch rear...would need to upgrade to a MW or Moser 12 bolt.

Jeff Warren built a good engine but would need better rods.
Then there is the need for new cam, springs, valves.
Because the PCM is limited to 7000rpm that would need replacing.

Using a 4L60E with a Locking YANK converter.
New cam would need more converter.
That would mean a rebuild and a new converter.
Then would need some chassis reinforcement to prevent breaking suspension supports.

Best numbers is a $15,000 investment.
Then would have to buy the expensive gasoline to meet NHRA rules.

What I hate the most is putting in a Roll Bar..
Like the fact I can get in and out of my car with out contortions.
At home can put my street tires on and take it for a drive.
Car has run a 12.68 on a cold day.

All those mods would get the car running low to mid 12s.
Maybe high 11's on a cold day.

Still have my 1969 Impala going through a full restoration.
It was a M/SA car that can now run K/SA.
That will take another year or so to finish.
But the Budd Rowe engine would need upgrading.
Finishing that car will be another $15,000.00
Selling it would help fund the 95 SS.

I am having fun in Pure Stock..
Can put back on the street with AC and the comforts the car came with.
Owned it from day one..

I agree NHRA does not need more classes.
My argument my car "as is" would best compete as NHRA R/SA.
Only have to add a few pages in the Rule Book.
Not asking for the moon !
Just want to race...!!

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

So, you're asking for Pure rules, but to be put into real Stock, where YOU think it should be?
Oh boy..
Where's Perrone when we need him? LOL

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Well said James! The truth hurts alot of times and some people just cant handle it or accept it!!

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Dan. Would like nhra to make a class called pure stock
Nhra has that class it’s called bracket racing you no show up with any car that passes tech
You are the main reasons Ihra folded.
You didn’t support your ihra by racing pure stock so they folded
Why is it that money to build a car is the reason you say nhra sucks?
You have a excuse every time someone points out your lack of knowledge
About class racing. Nhra will be fine without crate motors and pure stock
Keep replying to real racers with your all about what nhra should do to appease you
How many times a year do you race. ? Please reply with your excuse why you didn’t support ihra. That means paying at the gate

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

The tribal wisdom of the Dakota Indians says when you discover you’re riding a dead horse, the best strategy is to dismount.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

"Not asking for the moon!" Oh really!
You only want NHRA (which already has thousands of Stock Eliminator racers with cars built following the NHRA Cassification Guide and Rule Book), to change their long standing class structure, just so you can play in the NHRA "playground", but make up the classes and rules as YOU see fit! I am pretty sure that at least 99% of real NHRA Stockers don`t throw on a set of street tires and cruise to the local Burger Doodle hangout, they are RACE cars, that compete in a RACE class! I didn`t really like having to install a roll bar in my M/S Mustang either, but Stock rules required it, despite the fact that my car was never close to quick enough to need a bar as a bracket car.
You want to race, with no roll bar, without being fast enough to run the index, without spending some money to accomplish those things, sounds like Sportsman Bracket is perfect for you! But then, you also were not going to run NHRA anyhow, you had "other options", so why all the whining anyhow?

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Try reading that again, Dan. We had Stock way before I started in 1962. No Pure Stock.
NHRA tried Pure Stock many years later. Pure Stock did not "morph" into anything. Very small fields. Nearly zero interest. Kinda like IHRA. I wondered how long IHRA would survive when I tried running with them about ten years ago. Never saw car counts that low anywhere before, except at AHRA races when it was dying. Was not hard to see where it was headed. Single digit Super Stock fields, almost no purse. Not hard to see.

And, not everybody running NHRA writes big checks for engines, or have 5K or 6K transmissions.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

James,
As usual you miss the point and disrespect the opinion of others. If I still lived in the Land of NED I would certainly visit your pit area, discuss this like a man and wouldn't need Kenny's mediation. I never stated your cars are slow or your driving sucks, but if I where still racing I'd be in the garage outworking you on my stuff, not in front of my keyboard bloviating like you.
Warmest regards,
Frank

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I never thought about this idea! Pick your class based on et! So lets see here my slow C/SA at 10.80....I want to be an H/SA. Sounds great to me! I might and I stress MIGHT be able to win class at the U.S. Nationals. LOL

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Possibly if Butcher or Marshall are not in H lol!

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Wow you guys are scare of me!
The level of insults are unprecedented..that is ok.
Not slowing down....and you are going to have to catch me.

Whether you like it or not Pure Stock and Crate Motor are welcomed at all the S/SS associations.
NMCA picked them up last year!
CANAm runs IHRA cars at their NHRA events.
In fact racers are building new Pure Stockers.

NHRA is a great organization.
Even have an NHRA membership and Number
I am not a follower and chose my own direction and quests.

Stuff is brewing guys!
Watch this space!

Btw you want a piece of me.
See you at the TriState S/SS meet in November.

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I was not whining.
HR9121 asked a fair question and was genuine and gave him a fair answer.
As for made up classes.
NHRA made up FS...what I am asking should not be an issue!
Just don’t get what I am asking NHRA to do ... is such a threat to you?

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

That is why i stressed MIGHT...!!! Still have to drive and hope they arent holding more than what they have already shown!!!! And I bet they are!!!!!!

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Why would anybody be scared of you??

And, NHRA isn't going to add those classes. Get over it. Not enough cars to worry about. Won't even find those cars all over the country. Heck, IHRA wasn't all over the country.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I do not understand all this bickering back and forth.
When I was looking for a car, I had a choice of buying/building a bracket car to run at one of my three local tracks, an IHRA legal car or an NHRA legal car.
I chose to buy a NHRA legal car because it gave the options of running all three.
You chose to buy.build the car that you have/race.
If you had a bracket car and your local track cancelled the bracket racing program, would you be just as upset?
The IHRA is out of class racing. Any other group, which will accept your IHRA legal car is just a bracket racing group.
Your options are simple. Either build an NHRA legal combo, race with one of the organizations which will allow you to race, for the time being, or call it a day and stop racing.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

[QUOTE=Cdncarnut;548086]I do not understand all this bickering back and forth.
The IHRA is out of class racing. Any other group, which will accept your IHRA legal car is just a bracket racing group.

You do realize that 90% of NHRA class racing is this bracket racing that everyone seems to dislike. Kenny Bugaj must be sitting back and having a good chuckle over this thread.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Up there at the top of your post. Yeah, all of that. Everyone racing NHRA Stock Eliminator has already done all of that. But you, you want special exemption so that you can play on their field without making the same effort and expenditure.Yeah, to the people already in the class, you're asking for the moon, and being extremely disrespectful. It really is that damned simple, Dan.

We're currently parked, due to our jobs, and other things, such as my pending divorce. You don't see me on here crying for special exceptions so that we can race, and you won't. I have too much respect for our fellow racers to do that.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

[QUOTE=SSGN;548087]Class run offs are not bracket racing. They are real racing. If I could make one change to the NHRA rules, it would be that everyone runs off the class record. That will foster more competitions and weed out the people who just show up, with their cars and houses on wheels, bring in the real racers and maybe even put people in the stands.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Why don't you call yourself a U/SA? Then you could set the record!

Really???!!!

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Alan:
How am I being disrespectful ??
I have the right to petition!
Not asking for special exemptions.
Just asking to be added to the Class Structure.
It would be a benefit to Stock everywhere.

Just do not understand the ire?

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Don;
I did not make an arbitrary statement.
You are a lot smarter than that..!

The IHRA Pure Stock limits the Spring and Cam which limits HP and RPM.
All cars are classified by HP and Weight then falls under a Class.
The F/PS and R/SA Indexes are close.
So if NHRA wanted to adopt Pure Stock this would be a logical consideration.
Then they would make adjustments as they do with all cars for best fitment.

NHRA did that adopting all the Corporate Crate Motor Factor Stock Cars!!

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Adding special sections to the rules so that you can race your car, the way you want IS asking for special exceptions. The rules are written, every one racing in Stock Eliminator is following them. But not you. No, you feel you need special rules to suit you and your car.

No, it would NOT be beneficial to Stock Eliminator. It further waters down the class. It sure as Hell didn't work for IHRA, in case you missed it, they don't run Stock at all anymore. Wonder why?

How about this? The rules are set. There are plenty of cats and racers out there that race under the rules. If you want to play, build a car that fits the rules and race, like everyone else. Instead of thinking you're so special that the rules need to change for you.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Dan, those are factory race cars. They come with those engines. Not "crate motor" cars. Crying about it on the internet won't get NHRA to add those IHRA classes. Your not going to change it. They don't need you/them.

Build a car to fit, run someplace else, or go bracket racing. Hard for me to understand someone not simply building a car that could run anywhere to begin with. E T Bracket cars can, and cheaply.

Not all fast NHRA class cars have $6000.00 transmissions. Not all fast NHRA class cars have Warren Engines (or equivalent) professionally built engines. It's all more expensive for people that have to write big checks for everything.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Just so we all understand each other.....

What you want, are the NHRA rules written as what you perceive as correctly....

You are not the magnetic center of the Universe, as hard as it is for you to believe.....

The planets do not revolve around you....

By definition you are a contrarian who will fight to the death that your incorrect conclusion, is correct....

You happen to man without a country....

You are dressed up with no place to go...

I guess that I will also have to move on.....

See you around the pits, wait you have no place to race with your car as it sits now, so I guess that it will be my bad luck to keep coming across your inane posts on ClassRacer...

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Are you living in an alternate reality?

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Here Dan, let's make this extremely simple.

There are a bunch of guys playing baseball, with regulation baseballs, gloves, cleats, and wooden bats, on a regulation field. And now you come in with a softball and aluminum bat, and want the rules amended so that you can get in the middle of their game and make them play with you according to your rules.

And you don't understand their ire?

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I have a really slow car...I want NHRA to bring back Z/SA....I'll post it on class racer and get 10,000 hits....nothing changed.....

While it is good to seek the recommendations and guidance from your peers, ultimately nothing will happen regardless of how many pages are written.
Forum members do not have the mechanism available to change a sanctioning bodies rules.

Write a proposal to NHRA. Accept the answer.

I bought gt40p heads and a roller shortblock for M/CM...guess what? It'll make a great bracket motor unless a local association still allows IHRA combo's.

I asked NHRA for hp off of the 300 6 cyl ford, they said no, I moved on.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I know I'm old but I remember running Pure Stock with my Z-28 back in 1968. It was at Utica-Rome Dragway. I thought they were NHRA ? RC may know ? I'm not asking for pure stock back !

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I currently have an IHRA GT stock eliminator car that no longer has a specific class to race any longer. I can race the association races still. When I built this car close to 20 years ago IHRA had a very strong program and I didn't have any concern for running NHRA at that time. I and a lot of other people have seen the writing on the wall for a few years now, it still sucks that IHRA has given up on class racing. With that being said I do not expect NHRA to adopt these orphan classes and I am fine with that, they don't owe me anything. I will adapt and overcome and will be racing in 2018 one way or another.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Good one!!

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Hey Ken, I remember those years well. I won Pure Stock Eliminator ,with the Corvair, at The High Altitude Nationals in 1968. Ran an AMX in the final.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I don't get you guys?
What is wrong with asking NHRA to adopt Pure Stock ?
You don't get things done or changed without asking and making a good faith effort.

In the meantime got options with S/SS associations, local racing, NMCA, ECIRS, other organizations considering IHRA cars.
In fact can race in Canada with their races under the NHRA Banner.

How are these bad options expressed by your disparaging comments..!

I am not upset !!
Living the Life and having FUN !
My way !

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Ed;
I am not crying about it but having a conversation.
You guys are up in arms with all kinds of dirging comments.

The reason I went to Jeff because he does a good job at a fair price.
My local builder did not build Stocker engines and wanted to get it right.
Cost was the same except having to transport it.

As for $6000 transmissions...if you have one of those fast cars.
You are working the edges of performance and the cost that goes along with it.

Top Stocker Racers and FS at $100,000.00 + price tag better have one of those crack running trannys.

As for going to other venues... I will !!
Why do you make it sound like it is a bad thing?

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Nothing!!

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Perrone ! Watch Out ! That guy is from the Island and his name ends in a vowel !! He could be CONNECTED ! !

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I really don't see what the big deal is about letting the IHRA class cars run with the NHRA class cars. All you guys keep telling us to go bracket race. Um I'm really not sure if you guys are aware but that's all your doing now is bracket racing. So after reading all these complainers blogs all I can come up with is the guys that claim they have 50k to 100k in a car are pretty much scared of being trailered by a 20k dollar car running a crate motor abiding by the same rules as the 100k dollar cars have. Remember at the end of the day all it is is a high dollar bracket race. For the dilution comments, there are crate motor cars with a lot of money thrown at them as well. Why can't we all just race together and have fun. That's what it's all about. Stop being hateful. :cool:

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Boy, You and Fahey must be sharing talking points offline now.
First of all, nobody in the world is afraid of racing "Birch" .They don't even know who you are.
LMAO..
Where's that award?..
Oh, here it is:

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Do 8.0/170mph "Stockers" that have no VIN and can never be titled, licensed or insured for street use have a showroom available engine in a showroom available body?

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

There are already approx. 3,400 different engine+year combos in the Classification Guide, according to what I have found at classracerinfo.com. How many more would be added if crate motors were introduced? Maybe 15-20, each of which will have the exact same specs no matter what car in which they were installed.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

No, they don't.
But don't even dare trying to beat me over the head with that one again.
Instead, check the threads, going back about 9 years to see what I had to say about that caper.